1 00:00:58,670 --> 00:00:10,740 [Music] 2 00:01:00,770 --> 00:00:58,680 a view subscribe to our limits magazine 3 00:01:03,530 --> 00:01:00,780 yet if not you will miss out on the best 4 00:01:06,470 --> 00:01:03,540 articles from the best investigators and 5 00:01:08,570 --> 00:01:06,480 offers in the global paranormal field 6 00:01:10,730 --> 00:01:08,580 Ronald Kinsella his twin brother Phillip 7 00:01:12,350 --> 00:01:10,740 Phillip man called Peter Robbins Mary 8 00:01:15,110 --> 00:01:12,360 rod wealth and Malcolm 9 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:15,120 Robinson to name a few all contributed 10 00:01:20,630 --> 00:01:17,610 to past issues from Diane Tessman we 11 00:01:23,390 --> 00:01:20,640 have in issue 18 ghosts who are you or 12 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:23,400 grams watts look once our energy occurs 13 00:01:27,830 --> 00:01:25,770 Malcolm Magnussen looks at the grocery 14 00:01:29,930 --> 00:01:27,840 boy in the garden and examines an image 15 00:01:32,450 --> 00:01:29,940 is it a simple crumb of the world thing 16 00:01:35,749 --> 00:01:32,460 George Bishop reviews dr. arena Scott's 17 00:01:37,730 --> 00:01:35,759 secret corridors a book which examines 18 00:01:40,100 --> 00:01:37,740 the secrets beyond the real project 19 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:40,110 all right Patterson Air Force Base wasps 20 00:01:46,070 --> 00:01:42,450 well detailed memory metal and one and 21 00:01:48,230 --> 00:01:46,080 only dr. J Allen Hynek and UFO cover-ups 22 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:48,240 Adelle kuselias Rajah and the mutual 23 00:01:53,450 --> 00:01:51,210 among visitations adele s courses on a 24 00:01:56,450 --> 00:01:53,460 visit to the French reunion Islands 25 00:01:59,090 --> 00:01:56,460 located in the Indian Ocean east of 26 00:02:01,279 --> 00:01:59,100 Madagascar and the fascinatin encounter 27 00:02:03,859 --> 00:02:01,289 we'll look at bad UFO images the cached 28 00:02:06,740 --> 00:02:03,869 Landrum and McDonald affair we have a 29 00:02:08,990 --> 00:02:06,750 recall of anomalous experiences and 30 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:09,000 research from the Tibetan stalkers all 31 00:02:14,300 --> 00:02:11,850 Sinclair reports on a gigantic ft 32 00:02:16,340 --> 00:02:14,310 swatted up the English East Coast City 33 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:16,350 of Kingston upon holding over the 34 00:02:22,730 --> 00:02:19,410 Christmas period of 2018 while Chris 35 00:02:25,490 --> 00:02:22,740 Evers examines UFO reports which as 36 00:02:27,620 --> 00:02:25,500 presented in the local newspaper are all 37 00:02:30,470 --> 00:02:27,630 Daily Mail and gives possible 38 00:02:33,020 --> 00:02:30,480 explanations for these sightings all 39 00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:33,030 this and much more to remain up-to-date 40 00:02:40,970 --> 00:02:36,650 then you should really subscribe here 41 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:40,980 w-w-w dot Chris zero five nine seven dot 42 00:02:54,710 --> 00:02:47,970 Wix site comm /out er - limits 43 00:02:57,350 --> 00:02:54,720 - mag being farmed hello everybody once 44 00:03:00,260 --> 00:02:57,360 again and welcome to another edition of 45 00:03:03,050 --> 00:03:00,270 inside Outer Limits radio show joining 46 00:03:05,479 --> 00:03:03,060 me today as usual is my co-host Philip 47 00:03:06,290 --> 00:03:05,489 mantel across the man beyond flying this 48 00:03:08,570 --> 00:03:06,300 press 49 00:03:11,890 --> 00:03:08,580 our things go in Phil and I've good 50 00:03:15,020 --> 00:03:11,900 evening Chris yeah things have started 51 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:15,030 naturally for the new year sir so we got 52 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:16,890 lungs for the rest of you so can't 53 00:03:23,690 --> 00:03:20,850 complain really excellent excellent so 54 00:03:26,660 --> 00:03:23,700 we've got one of your authors with us 55 00:03:29,150 --> 00:03:26,670 today I believe and would like to 56 00:03:30,710 --> 00:03:29,160 introduce the Phil yes I mean she lives 57 00:03:35,030 --> 00:03:30,720 in Ohio 58 00:03:37,340 --> 00:03:35,040 dr. Irina Scott I'm fortunate I think 59 00:03:40,430 --> 00:03:37,350 enough to have worked with Irina over 60 00:03:44,810 --> 00:03:40,440 what last couple of years on three books 61 00:03:48,020 --> 00:03:44,820 and her third book sacred corridors is 62 00:03:50,900 --> 00:03:48,030 literally out now and I'm hoping we'll 63 00:03:54,110 --> 00:03:50,910 be able to touch more on that and her 64 00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:54,120 work in general Chris well sacred 65 00:03:57,830 --> 00:03:56,130 corridors that this is the new one isn't 66 00:04:00,410 --> 00:03:57,840 it that was released I believe wrong 67 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:00,420 about the first of January the secrets 68 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:02,450 beyond the real project Bluebook 69 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:05,490 wright-patterson Air Force Base Ross 70 00:04:12,500 --> 00:04:09,290 well Patel at Battelle a memory metal 71 00:04:14,210 --> 00:04:12,510 dr. J Allen Hynek and UFL cook what's up 72 00:04:15,949 --> 00:04:14,220 cover-ups he's not correct well that's 73 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:15,959 it covers just about anything and 74 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:18,930 everything there but I'm sure Irina will 75 00:04:26,030 --> 00:04:21,890 will expand on that as we go along 76 00:04:27,830 --> 00:04:26,040 so a there arena so I am hello there 77 00:04:30,890 --> 00:04:27,840 nice to speak with you hello to both of 78 00:04:32,060 --> 00:04:30,900 you and glad to be here thank you very 79 00:04:37,940 --> 00:04:32,070 much for joining us 80 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:37,950 so dr. Irina Scott how did you get 81 00:04:41,840 --> 00:04:40,650 involved with this subject what was it 82 00:04:43,790 --> 00:04:41,850 that brought you in did you have a 83 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:43,800 sighting when he was younger or see 84 00:04:49,250 --> 00:04:45,530 something completely different 85 00:04:52,460 --> 00:04:49,260 well I came from a Midwestern family 86 00:04:57,740 --> 00:04:52,470 where everybody and nobody ever talks 87 00:04:59,810 --> 00:04:57,750 about anything like UFOs and but my 88 00:05:02,960 --> 00:04:59,820 sister and I had something happened to 89 00:05:05,140 --> 00:05:02,970 so we were very young where we had 90 00:05:08,090 --> 00:05:05,150 something flying around their room and 91 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:08,100 it wasn't anything like a normal thing 92 00:05:14,570 --> 00:05:10,650 it was in our bedroom that was at night 93 00:05:17,900 --> 00:05:14,580 but it was a clear night and we both 94 00:05:20,210 --> 00:05:17,910 woke up at the same time and then after 95 00:05:23,300 --> 00:05:20,220 around for a while flew around the 96 00:05:25,820 --> 00:05:23,310 like a guided wayward didn't bump into 97 00:05:28,580 --> 00:05:25,830 anything and then we both became 98 00:05:33,830 --> 00:05:28,590 terrified at the same time and ran out 99 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:33,840 of room for years and years and years we 100 00:05:38,570 --> 00:05:35,370 didn't know anything about it 101 00:05:42,280 --> 00:05:38,580 and then I read the English person 102 00:05:45,380 --> 00:05:42,290 Jenny Randall's who wrote a book about 103 00:05:51,230 --> 00:05:45,390 bedroom visitations of young children 104 00:05:54,140 --> 00:05:51,240 and after that a lot of people become 105 00:05:58,640 --> 00:05:54,150 sir like repeaters and can you continue 106 00:06:00,620 --> 00:05:58,650 to have sightings and so my it's my 107 00:06:02,510 --> 00:06:00,630 slight awareness although I didn't know 108 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:02,520 at the time I didn't even know about you 109 00:06:10,220 --> 00:06:04,890 if it was at the time started probably 110 00:06:12,970 --> 00:06:10,230 started back then okay so of course 111 00:06:15,650 --> 00:06:12,980 Jenny Randall's is that a prolific 112 00:06:18,020 --> 00:06:15,660 British investigator and often I also 113 00:06:20,990 --> 00:06:18,030 believe also believe feel that she's one 114 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:21,000 of your rare compatriots as well yeah I 115 00:06:26,690 --> 00:06:23,130 mean Jenny and I were both members of 116 00:06:28,820 --> 00:06:26,700 the British UFO research Association and 117 00:06:32,659 --> 00:06:28,830 Jenny was the director of investigation 118 00:06:35,990 --> 00:06:32,669 for many years and once Jenny had left 119 00:06:37,700 --> 00:06:36,000 that position I took over and I think I 120 00:06:40,370 --> 00:06:37,710 was in that position for about three or 121 00:06:42,230 --> 00:06:40,380 four years and as you said quite a 122 00:06:45,409 --> 00:06:42,240 prolific author so it comes as no 123 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:45,419 surprise that even across the pond you 124 00:06:52,670 --> 00:06:47,970 know somebody's picked up one of Jenny's 125 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:52,680 books and honest as found it of ussen of 126 00:06:59,780 --> 00:06:56,210 interest so no surprise there at all 127 00:07:02,300 --> 00:06:59,790 okay so so em re now how did you go from 128 00:07:04,990 --> 00:07:02,310 the sighting then that you had when you 129 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:05,000 was younger how did you actually go to 130 00:07:12,290 --> 00:07:09,690 investigating UFO sightings well Jenny 131 00:07:14,630 --> 00:07:12,300 had said that it's sort of a pattern in 132 00:07:16,130 --> 00:07:14,640 some people that they see yeah that they 133 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:16,140 see something young like in their 134 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:20,010 bedroom and see things later and usually 135 00:07:24,980 --> 00:07:23,010 that's one person but in our case it was 136 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:24,990 not both my sister and I so we both had 137 00:07:30,740 --> 00:07:29,130 another witness saw and then we had 138 00:07:33,860 --> 00:07:30,750 several other sightings later and 139 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:33,870 another very long one together 140 00:07:41,150 --> 00:07:38,370 and at the time it happened I was 141 00:07:43,820 --> 00:07:41,160 working for the DIA and had a high 142 00:07:46,879 --> 00:07:43,830 security clearance and so I wasn't going 143 00:07:48,980 --> 00:07:46,889 to go around saying oh I see UFOs that I 144 00:07:51,350 --> 00:07:48,990 took work with notes on it and intended 145 00:07:56,810 --> 00:07:51,360 to do something later and then many 146 00:07:59,420 --> 00:07:56,820 years later I recorded our earlier 147 00:08:03,920 --> 00:07:59,430 sightings to the Center for UFO studies 148 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:03,930 and then after that chili exactly I join 149 00:08:15,469 --> 00:08:12,090 several UFO groups okay so how did you 150 00:08:17,150 --> 00:08:15,479 become involved them with the actual how 151 00:08:18,500 --> 00:08:17,160 did you become involved out how did how 152 00:08:20,300 --> 00:08:18,510 did you start to put all this 153 00:08:22,610 --> 00:08:20,310 information that you've that you've 154 00:08:27,379 --> 00:08:22,620 acquired over the years and into your 155 00:08:29,210 --> 00:08:27,389 series of three books well I didn't come 156 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:29,220 out and say I see you I was wrong 157 00:08:36,560 --> 00:08:33,450 I know that but I started investigating 158 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:36,570 when I went group I belong din was the 159 00:08:42,529 --> 00:08:38,130 first one at the Lincoln was a local 160 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:42,539 Columbus Crew CONUS Ohio and there were 161 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:45,290 only six people in but we all just went 162 00:08:57,199 --> 00:08:53,130 investigate not crazy and I I saw that 163 00:09:01,810 --> 00:08:57,209 new and spent a lot of time 164 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:01,820 investigating and so I had a lot of I 165 00:09:09,230 --> 00:09:05,010 was also the editor of their newsletter 166 00:09:13,449 --> 00:09:09,240 and so I had a lot of UFO stories to 167 00:09:17,870 --> 00:09:13,459 write a news letter and then later I 168 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:17,880 became I was on the board of directors 169 00:09:23,690 --> 00:09:20,850 of MUFON yeah I wasn't director 170 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:23,700 publications which meant I still was 171 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:24,810 doing a lot of writing 172 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:29,850 well after you it occurred to me that I 173 00:09:34,910 --> 00:09:31,890 could that I kind of had written a book 174 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:34,920 and so I had to put it together and 175 00:09:41,750 --> 00:09:37,290 divide it into chapters and everything 176 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:41,760 but that's what started me okay so out 177 00:09:47,049 --> 00:09:44,970 of all those those early cases that year 178 00:09:48,999 --> 00:09:47,059 that you investigated that you where 179 00:09:51,249 --> 00:09:49,009 with that you wrote about is there any 180 00:09:53,739 --> 00:09:51,259 particular case that stands out far 181 00:09:54,939 --> 00:09:53,749 above the others there are two that 182 00:10:04,529 --> 00:09:54,949 stood out 183 00:10:09,819 --> 00:10:04,539 one is the robinia Ohio sighting of the 184 00:10:12,609 --> 00:10:09,829 flowering Nash the two policemen and it 185 00:10:16,269 --> 00:10:12,619 was in Ohio but it was multi-state and 186 00:10:21,029 --> 00:10:16,279 it started with a report in Michigan of 187 00:10:24,099 --> 00:10:21,039 this house sized UFO and these two 188 00:10:27,279 --> 00:10:24,109 deputies spark and I think it's mounted 189 00:10:29,409 --> 00:10:27,289 deputy national heard about on the radio 190 00:10:31,869 --> 00:10:29,419 and they just laughed and everything and 191 00:10:37,059 --> 00:10:31,879 then as they were laughing something 192 00:10:39,009 --> 00:10:37,069 came up over the trees and it was a big 193 00:10:46,569 --> 00:10:39,019 bright thing and they were pretty 194 00:10:49,899 --> 00:10:46,579 terrified and so anyway they called into 195 00:10:51,879 --> 00:10:49,909 the police station this this is um it 196 00:10:53,859 --> 00:10:51,889 was investigated while it was going on 197 00:10:56,169 --> 00:10:53,869 is what was really interesting last a 198 00:10:58,059 --> 00:10:56,179 long time and it was investigated by 199 00:11:01,059 --> 00:10:58,069 authorities such as police they call 200 00:11:04,329 --> 00:11:01,069 into the police station and eventually 201 00:11:07,179 --> 00:11:04,339 so they said shoot it well they were 202 00:11:12,369 --> 00:11:07,189 terrified and they didn't think shooting 203 00:11:14,879 --> 00:11:12,379 it was a good idea so we followed it and 204 00:11:17,949 --> 00:11:14,889 they run the police radio all the time 205 00:11:19,869 --> 00:11:17,959 broadcasting what was going on and it 206 00:11:24,219 --> 00:11:19,879 was very interesting because the object 207 00:11:25,719 --> 00:11:24,229 was fear active and like if it got a hit 208 00:11:27,639 --> 00:11:25,729 of him it would slow down until they 209 00:11:29,589 --> 00:11:27,649 caught up with him and it would go 210 00:11:31,569 --> 00:11:29,599 higher when it went over cities and 211 00:11:34,749 --> 00:11:31,579 things like that and a whole lot of 212 00:11:38,199 --> 00:11:34,759 people saw it and some other police 213 00:11:41,399 --> 00:11:38,209 started following it too they followed 214 00:11:44,229 --> 00:11:41,409 it all the way in the Pennsylvania and 215 00:11:46,509 --> 00:11:44,239 they had heard on the radio that jets 216 00:11:49,869 --> 00:11:46,519 were scrambled and that had been on 217 00:11:51,749 --> 00:11:49,879 radiant on radar and so it was just an 218 00:11:54,639 --> 00:11:51,759 excellent sighting 219 00:12:03,550 --> 00:11:54,649 can I interrupt that I mean what year 220 00:12:10,130 --> 00:12:07,490 1966 I'm not real okay so what reminds 221 00:12:13,300 --> 00:12:10,140 me of of course and I may be totally 222 00:12:16,430 --> 00:12:13,310 wrong here which is not unusual Irina 223 00:12:19,130 --> 00:12:16,440 kinda reminds me of the police chase in 224 00:12:22,070 --> 00:12:19,140 the movie Close Encounters of the Third 225 00:12:23,990 --> 00:12:22,080 Kind where the police officers chase it 226 00:12:26,540 --> 00:12:24,000 over state lines and things like that 227 00:12:29,390 --> 00:12:26,550 and it all comes to a an ending where 228 00:12:32,810 --> 00:12:29,400 they one of the police cars you know 229 00:12:38,270 --> 00:12:32,820 goes over the edge of the hill well God 230 00:12:40,220 --> 00:12:38,280 could could that well be that's I people 231 00:12:43,940 --> 00:12:40,230 have reported that's where they seem 232 00:12:50,300 --> 00:12:43,950 from Spielberg's Newman came from that 233 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:50,310 he took that from that event was 234 00:12:54,980 --> 00:12:53,130 fascinating as you were explaining it 235 00:12:58,420 --> 00:12:54,990 there and I'm sorry running that scene 236 00:13:00,740 --> 00:12:58,430 from from the movie in in my in my head 237 00:13:02,990 --> 00:13:00,750 you said there was another one another 238 00:13:06,190 --> 00:13:03,000 sighting that stands out from me from 239 00:13:10,490 --> 00:13:06,200 your early investigations which was that 240 00:13:14,540 --> 00:13:10,500 this is one I investigated myself and I 241 00:13:18,500 --> 00:13:14,550 think we call it the dancing lights and 242 00:13:20,870 --> 00:13:18,510 this was some people also in Ohio but it 243 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:20,880 what I it was quite a considered a good 244 00:13:26,270 --> 00:13:23,130 cycling because there were a Thor ities 245 00:13:28,430 --> 00:13:26,280 watching it and a big group of people 246 00:13:32,860 --> 00:13:28,440 and they tried the fulfillment and it 247 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:32,870 they stay around a long time this was um 248 00:13:40,730 --> 00:13:37,530 when a family went out and they it was 249 00:13:44,060 --> 00:13:40,740 very rural area and over there cornfield 250 00:13:46,130 --> 00:13:44,070 they saw these lights and they were kind 251 00:13:48,830 --> 00:13:46,140 of dancing going up and down around and 252 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:48,840 things and they had no idea what they 253 00:13:56,270 --> 00:13:53,010 were so they called the police and they 254 00:13:58,460 --> 00:13:56,280 called the TV and the radio and the 255 00:14:00,580 --> 00:13:58,470 nearest airport and everything else 256 00:14:04,070 --> 00:14:00,590 trying to mount what was going on 257 00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:04,080 Wow well the display was still going on 258 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:08,730 and police came out and looked at it the 259 00:14:14,420 --> 00:14:11,850 airport said nothing was over there so 260 00:14:23,950 --> 00:14:14,430 it was investigated by authorities while 261 00:14:30,620 --> 00:14:27,440 the lights still stayed there and they 262 00:14:32,329 --> 00:14:30,630 were kind of interactive because a car 263 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:32,339 was coming down the road toward the 264 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:34,890 house and one of the lights came down 265 00:14:41,540 --> 00:14:38,370 followed the car and I think right after 266 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:41,550 that there was a very funny noise it was 267 00:14:47,210 --> 00:14:44,690 kinda like a gear but not like a deer 268 00:14:52,070 --> 00:14:47,220 breathing hard or something snorting and 269 00:14:55,750 --> 00:14:52,080 then later somebody and some authorities 270 00:14:58,670 --> 00:14:55,760 found out about it because they said two 271 00:15:05,660 --> 00:14:58,680 airplanes started flying over the 272 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:05,670 cornfield in a grid pattern and one of 273 00:15:10,250 --> 00:15:08,010 the lights went up and followed the 274 00:15:12,380 --> 00:15:10,260 airplane for a while and this went on 275 00:15:14,540 --> 00:15:12,390 until 12 o'clock 276 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:14,550 I don't remember quit I think they went 277 00:15:19,820 --> 00:15:17,490 them bad or something and every the 278 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:19,830 police had been out looking at it and 279 00:15:24,380 --> 00:15:21,810 everything I filmed that it wasn't a 280 00:15:27,079 --> 00:15:24,390 good filter and nobody ever knew what it 281 00:15:31,370 --> 00:15:27,089 was and what was kind of more 282 00:15:34,790 --> 00:15:31,380 interesting is that when a couple of 283 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:34,800 people such as well growling I went to 284 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:38,490 really investigate but then another 285 00:15:46,610 --> 00:15:42,450 person I went out later to investigating 286 00:15:49,579 --> 00:15:46,620 also and the night after we were there 287 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:49,589 apparently the lights came back so she 288 00:15:59,900 --> 00:15:55,770 stayed longer maybe we had seen him am i 289 00:16:03,220 --> 00:15:59,910 right in thinking Irena you've also seen 290 00:16:06,199 --> 00:16:03,230 all the light 7uu personally 291 00:16:11,030 --> 00:16:06,209 those being the Marfa lights in Texas is 292 00:16:13,310 --> 00:16:11,040 that correct yes I mean for those who 293 00:16:15,050 --> 00:16:13,320 are not aware that our route areas 294 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:15,060 around the world that seemed to have a 295 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:17,010 concentration of lights you're one of 296 00:16:22,850 --> 00:16:20,010 those locations of gosse's is Martha in 297 00:16:25,730 --> 00:16:22,860 Texas there's the MinMin lights in 298 00:16:28,100 --> 00:16:25,740 Australia whereas the Pennine spook 299 00:16:30,319 --> 00:16:28,110 lights here in the UK 300 00:16:32,569 --> 00:16:30,329 the lights in hostel on in central 301 00:16:34,490 --> 00:16:32,579 Norway I think I remember you sent me I 302 00:16:37,310 --> 00:16:34,500 think it was on the picture on a film of 303 00:16:40,610 --> 00:16:37,320 the of the Marfa lights would you like 304 00:16:44,230 --> 00:16:40,620 to tell us about that please yes um I 305 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:44,240 didn't exactly believe in and I was 306 00:16:51,590 --> 00:16:47,730 visiting some people there it in 307 00:16:55,610 --> 00:16:51,600 stinging in bedroom were mine before my 308 00:16:57,920 --> 00:16:55,620 window pointed towards Marfa I was about 309 00:17:00,230 --> 00:16:57,930 20 miles away and on top of the mountain 310 00:17:02,870 --> 00:17:00,240 so that you could see across the were 311 00:17:05,329 --> 00:17:02,880 not market was and I was interested in 312 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:05,339 the Marfa lights and I went with several 313 00:17:13,039 --> 00:17:08,610 people they have a lookout area around 314 00:17:15,530 --> 00:17:13,049 Marfa to look for the lights and I went 315 00:17:17,059 --> 00:17:15,540 and people said all they saw lights but 316 00:17:19,069 --> 00:17:17,069 it didn't impress me at all because I 317 00:17:20,990 --> 00:17:19,079 just thought they were people driving 318 00:17:23,210 --> 00:17:21,000 along the roads in the mountains and you 319 00:17:27,230 --> 00:17:23,220 know making lights and things I didn't 320 00:17:29,180 --> 00:17:27,240 think anything about it and I so I 321 00:17:31,039 --> 00:17:29,190 wasn't used to looking out the window 322 00:17:33,380 --> 00:17:31,049 and looking standing on the deck and 323 00:17:35,510 --> 00:17:33,390 looking over Martha and it was pretty 324 00:17:38,180 --> 00:17:35,520 interesting because I can use telephoto 325 00:17:41,690 --> 00:17:38,190 lens at night and get pictures and 326 00:17:46,010 --> 00:17:41,700 marvelous this impressive man me because 327 00:17:49,970 --> 00:17:46,020 I'm not live in the mountains but one 328 00:17:53,510 --> 00:17:49,980 night I think one of the people in the 329 00:17:58,909 --> 00:17:53,520 house got sick or something and I was 330 00:18:03,409 --> 00:17:58,919 out on the porch and I saw this white 331 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:03,419 over Marcia and I watched it and watched 332 00:18:08,870 --> 00:18:06,450 it it just stayed still and it was 333 00:18:11,630 --> 00:18:08,880 pretty bright it was brighter than the 334 00:18:15,789 --> 00:18:11,640 regular town lights and wonderful and so 335 00:18:18,850 --> 00:18:15,799 fun I went in got my video recorder and 336 00:18:22,039 --> 00:18:18,860 stood there and recorded for a while and 337 00:18:25,750 --> 00:18:22,049 it it just stayed there it would very 338 00:18:29,330 --> 00:18:25,760 slowly blink off and then blink on up 339 00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:29,340 but it didn't move around and in that 340 00:18:33,020 --> 00:18:31,530 place of Texas it was really isolated if 341 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:33,030 you saw an airplane you went out and 342 00:18:36,980 --> 00:18:35,250 looked at it because it was so on there 343 00:18:39,799 --> 00:18:36,990 were there was a airport at Mars from 344 00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:39,809 that it was closed I think it closed at 345 00:18:44,780 --> 00:18:41,730 five o'clock or something 346 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:44,790 and so in being the desert I wasn't real 347 00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:47,490 sure exactly where it was but it looked 348 00:18:51,770 --> 00:18:49,410 like it was over Marfa but maybe it 349 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:51,780 wasn't but it was a bright light and 350 00:19:00,710 --> 00:18:54,050 just stayed there then move around and 351 00:19:05,690 --> 00:19:00,720 so finally I I was taping by hand and I 352 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:05,700 went in to get the to find a tripod and 353 00:19:09,650 --> 00:19:07,410 I couldn't flame one that sit on I can't 354 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:09,660 really looked around quite well and when 355 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:13,770 I went back out it was gone but I taped 356 00:19:18,380 --> 00:19:15,810 it for quite a while and it didn't move 357 00:19:21,260 --> 00:19:18,390 it would very slowly go off and on 358 00:19:23,090 --> 00:19:21,270 and what would another thing that was 359 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:23,100 kind of interesting and another person 360 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:26,250 pointed out to me was is that it went 361 00:19:34,700 --> 00:19:31,530 off once it was a clear night and I 362 00:19:36,260 --> 00:19:34,710 think was right after it went off me no 363 00:19:40,220 --> 00:19:36,270 I think it was when I was coming back on 364 00:19:42,230 --> 00:19:40,230 there was a bright flash and I just 365 00:19:44,570 --> 00:19:42,240 thought I think I even said on the 366 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:44,580 corner that must be heat lightning but 367 00:19:48,020 --> 00:19:46,530 somebody else said maybe that had 368 00:19:50,770 --> 00:19:48,030 something to do with the light coming 369 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:50,780 back one and so I don't know but 370 00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:53,010 whatever it was it didn't move around 371 00:19:58,610 --> 00:19:57,090 and you expect it to sort of move well 372 00:20:02,390 --> 00:19:58,620 of course are any you have an academic 373 00:20:04,730 --> 00:20:02,400 background perhaps you know if you you 374 00:20:08,390 --> 00:20:04,740 know for our listeners who haven't read 375 00:20:10,070 --> 00:20:08,400 any books are but not aware of who just 376 00:20:15,380 --> 00:20:10,080 give us a little bit of detail about you 377 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:15,390 your academic background please I have a 378 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:19,890 PhD from University of Missouri in 379 00:20:27,620 --> 00:20:25,410 veterinary medicine college I did 380 00:20:30,950 --> 00:20:27,630 postdoctoral research at Cornell 381 00:20:34,360 --> 00:20:30,960 University and I had a professorship of 382 00:20:37,100 --> 00:20:34,370 st. Bonaventure University in New York 383 00:20:40,370 --> 00:20:37,110 my Master's was from the University of 384 00:20:43,130 --> 00:20:40,380 Nevada and bachelors from Ohio State 385 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:43,140 University in astronomy and biology my 386 00:20:51,650 --> 00:20:49,050 PhD was in Physiology I had also been I 387 00:20:54,830 --> 00:20:51,660 had also worked for the Defense 388 00:20:57,560 --> 00:20:54,840 Intelligence Agency the DIA 389 00:21:03,110 --> 00:20:57,570 and this is a PhD level job it was a 390 00:21:06,610 --> 00:21:03,120 Jason Levin and it required it above 391 00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:09,590 yeah you have Trish and I a great 392 00:21:14,750 --> 00:21:11,850 disadvantage here Irina I think between 393 00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:14,760 us I think we can muster our cycling 394 00:21:20,570 --> 00:21:17,730 proficiency tests Zabar has about the 395 00:21:23,090 --> 00:21:20,580 only qualifications we have the snow 396 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:23,100 this should I expect to my co-host but I 397 00:21:27,290 --> 00:21:25,410 just know I have over City and Guilds II 398 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:27,300 know many to advise filling us about 399 00:21:33,350 --> 00:21:29,850 weights because that's all the time that 400 00:21:36,110 --> 00:21:33,360 I specially when it's as cold as it is 401 00:21:38,090 --> 00:21:36,120 right now yes he does ya know one of the 402 00:21:45,890 --> 00:21:38,100 things I wanted to mention yet I mean 403 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:45,900 you've touched on I know you know K I 404 00:21:51,380 --> 00:21:48,330 mean you you and I despite never meeting 405 00:21:54,350 --> 00:21:51,390 of course in person we have worked 406 00:21:56,570 --> 00:21:54,360 together on probably you know part of 407 00:22:00,410 --> 00:21:56,580 the world's of the certainly best-known 408 00:22:07,220 --> 00:22:00,420 case and that was Roswell and we worked 409 00:22:09,740 --> 00:22:07,230 on that the the testimony possibly there 410 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:09,750 previously unknown witness to the 411 00:22:17,540 --> 00:22:11,970 Roswell event and that was deputy 412 00:22:18,830 --> 00:22:17,550 sheriff Charles focus you want me to say 413 00:22:20,360 --> 00:22:18,840 a little bit more about that I would you 414 00:22:22,820 --> 00:22:20,370 like to tell our listeners it you know a 415 00:22:26,690 --> 00:22:22,830 little bit more about deputy Fergus you 416 00:22:28,430 --> 00:22:26,700 probably know more about it than I do it 417 00:22:30,350 --> 00:22:28,440 was for those are not aware of about 418 00:22:33,140 --> 00:22:30,360 four or five years ago I can't remember 419 00:22:36,500 --> 00:22:33,150 the exact day I was contacted by a film 420 00:22:41,090 --> 00:22:36,510 company in the u.s. called white tiger 421 00:22:43,730 --> 00:22:41,100 films and basically they made you know 422 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:43,740 real-life movies so in other words at 423 00:22:49,250 --> 00:22:45,690 Eckerd real life story and make a movie 424 00:22:51,590 --> 00:22:49,260 out of it I'm one of their clients had 425 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:51,600 been a lady who was a private 426 00:22:59,450 --> 00:22:55,610 investigator I forget her name now but 427 00:23:04,400 --> 00:22:59,460 she sadly passed away and her her 428 00:23:06,230 --> 00:23:04,410 offspring her son and daughter now when 429 00:23:08,360 --> 00:23:06,240 going through her files and they found 430 00:23:11,659 --> 00:23:08,370 one file that simply said Roswell 431 00:23:15,860 --> 00:23:11,669 now when that file was a videocassette I 432 00:23:20,330 --> 00:23:15,870 think it was dated 1999 I believe while 433 00:23:23,210 --> 00:23:20,340 there abouts a videocassette in very 434 00:23:26,510 --> 00:23:23,220 informal interview with the gentleman 435 00:23:28,700 --> 00:23:26,520 and there was a transcript to that 436 00:23:31,610 --> 00:23:28,710 interview along with some possible 437 00:23:35,419 --> 00:23:31,620 contacts and the money question was 438 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:35,429 deputy Charles Fergus now he claimed 439 00:23:46,669 --> 00:23:41,850 that after the war he joined the police 440 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:46,679 force at big springs in Texas now he was 441 00:23:53,180 --> 00:23:50,970 a deputy sheriff and they were looking 442 00:23:56,450 --> 00:23:53,190 for a gentleman who had been cashing 443 00:23:59,210 --> 00:23:56,460 some Dutch checks around the area and he 444 00:24:02,470 --> 00:23:59,220 apparently had turned up in Roswell and 445 00:24:09,710 --> 00:24:02,480 was under arrest and in jail there so 446 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:09,720 he's the sheriff found him made a date 447 00:24:16,789 --> 00:24:11,250 to go and pick this guy up but they were 448 00:24:20,389 --> 00:24:16,799 on route and apparently this is the 449 00:24:23,990 --> 00:24:20,399 testimony you gave that they heard about 450 00:24:26,299 --> 00:24:24,000 the UFO crash on the police radio and 451 00:24:30,169 --> 00:24:26,309 made a detour I'm cutting a long story 452 00:24:32,930 --> 00:24:30,179 short here I mean as you well know and 453 00:24:35,930 --> 00:24:32,940 witnessed the the crash the recovery 454 00:24:38,289 --> 00:24:35,940 were not forcibly removed from the site 455 00:24:40,460 --> 00:24:38,299 but they were told you know to go away 456 00:24:43,970 --> 00:24:40,470 and they saw they carried on their 457 00:24:45,620 --> 00:24:43,980 business picked up the prisoner and took 458 00:24:50,149 --> 00:24:45,630 him back and it really didn't speak 459 00:24:51,669 --> 00:24:50,159 about it again but you helped research 460 00:24:57,710 --> 00:24:51,679 this as well 461 00:25:01,399 --> 00:24:57,720 irena because you know I passed this on 462 00:25:03,260 --> 00:25:01,409 to you and you managed to track down at 463 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:03,270 some of these relatives I believe was it 464 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:06,570 a nephew on a son first of all I tracked 465 00:25:11,659 --> 00:25:09,330 down his nephew and he sort of 466 00:25:16,010 --> 00:25:11,669 contradicted the story a little bit 467 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:16,020 because um we have looked up the name of 468 00:25:21,310 --> 00:25:19,770 the sheriff they went with he went with 469 00:25:23,860 --> 00:25:21,320 and planet 470 00:25:28,360 --> 00:25:23,870 when the man was Sheriff and these 471 00:25:30,730 --> 00:25:28,370 didn't go together and so I continued 472 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:30,740 investigating and you know I thought 473 00:25:35,050 --> 00:25:33,530 well maybe that's not good but then I 474 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:35,060 keep on investigating and I found the 475 00:25:43,470 --> 00:25:37,970 man's son and the mountain man's son 476 00:25:46,390 --> 00:25:43,480 said that that that wasn't right that 477 00:25:49,570 --> 00:25:46,400 the II didn't know what sheriff he was 478 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:49,580 with so he it could have happened at the 479 00:25:55,420 --> 00:25:53,450 time of Roswell and so the date might 480 00:25:58,560 --> 00:25:55,430 have been you know it might have been 481 00:26:01,300 --> 00:25:58,570 possible it didn't happen during Roswell 482 00:26:03,310 --> 00:26:01,310 but did he so not say that his father 483 00:26:06,610 --> 00:26:03,320 told him about this event back in the 484 00:26:10,180 --> 00:26:06,620 sort of early 1950s yes his father 485 00:26:12,370 --> 00:26:10,190 calling about mother was a kid yeah of 486 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:12,380 course in the 1950s Roswell had already 487 00:26:17,980 --> 00:26:15,770 disappeared off the map anyway and I 488 00:26:20,500 --> 00:26:17,990 think you know I think between his we 489 00:26:22,630 --> 00:26:20,510 did we did a good job Irina and I think 490 00:26:26,050 --> 00:26:22,640 you know you can never be a hundred 491 00:26:28,930 --> 00:26:26,060 percent certain but I think when you 492 00:26:30,370 --> 00:26:28,940 discovered the the relatives and 493 00:26:32,370 --> 00:26:30,380 certainly the son I think we were 494 00:26:34,810 --> 00:26:32,380 vindicating in releasing the information 495 00:26:37,780 --> 00:26:34,820 which of course was published in your 496 00:26:41,710 --> 00:26:37,790 first book UFOs today would you not 497 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:41,720 agree with that yes and I published more 498 00:26:51,220 --> 00:26:44,930 in the next book too but yes I thought 499 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:51,230 we did a good job especially you and you 500 00:26:56,380 --> 00:26:52,490 know you don't know for sure we just 501 00:26:59,140 --> 00:26:56,390 published it to put it out on the public 502 00:27:02,590 --> 00:26:59,150 domain and that's how you found them out 503 00:27:04,990 --> 00:27:02,600 found out about his nephew I think the 504 00:27:08,860 --> 00:27:05,000 nephew contacted you yes he did yeah I 505 00:27:11,860 --> 00:27:08,870 mean I even have a photograph of the Big 506 00:27:15,010 --> 00:27:11,870 Springs Sheriff Department office in the 507 00:27:17,860 --> 00:27:15,020 late 1930s and it really hadn't changed 508 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:17,870 much from the cowboy days when I 509 00:27:22,170 --> 00:27:20,090 contacted the Sheriff's Department in 510 00:27:24,610 --> 00:27:22,180 Big Springs and various other agencies 511 00:27:26,590 --> 00:27:24,620 looking for records and let's just say 512 00:27:29,830 --> 00:27:26,600 they just laughed so back in those days 513 00:27:31,630 --> 00:27:29,840 we just didn't keep them you know so how 514 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:31,640 things have changed somewhat Irene I 515 00:27:38,350 --> 00:27:34,970 would but hot 516 00:27:41,890 --> 00:27:38,360 now is a it's a joke my never got to 517 00:27:44,700 --> 00:27:41,900 meet because the History Channel of the 518 00:27:48,010 --> 00:27:44,710 other new chair a new show coming out 519 00:27:50,169 --> 00:27:48,020 Project Blue Book and the gentleman in 520 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:50,179 question of course is he's dr. Allen 521 00:28:01,690 --> 00:27:52,970 Hynek and I believe did you have a meet 522 00:28:03,310 --> 00:28:01,700 Hynek Irena I think I met him at a book 523 00:28:03,940 --> 00:28:03,320 signing things I talked to him on the 524 00:28:07,799 --> 00:28:03,950 phone 525 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:07,809 but I've seen him and I've seen him talk 526 00:28:12,789 --> 00:28:11,330 but I don't remember whether I talked to 527 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:12,799 him or Madigan 528 00:28:17,590 --> 00:28:15,530 I mean I've talked to one the film they 529 00:28:20,820 --> 00:28:17,600 don't remember like talk to him in 530 00:28:23,919 --> 00:28:20,830 person I was looking at him I have a 531 00:28:30,130 --> 00:28:23,929 book that he sign a book signing so I 532 00:28:35,350 --> 00:28:30,140 must at least talk to a little bit but 533 00:28:39,340 --> 00:28:35,360 Jim so blue book the TV show coming out 534 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:39,350 now Irina and your book is out to sort 535 00:28:44,230 --> 00:28:41,450 of buy a no coincidence to coincide with 536 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:44,240 that and other things it's the 50th 537 00:28:50,770 --> 00:28:47,690 anniversary of the closure of Project 538 00:28:53,049 --> 00:28:50,780 Blue Book which of course said at the 539 00:28:55,029 --> 00:28:53,059 end of it that you know basically there 540 00:28:57,039 --> 00:28:55,039 wasn't anything to worry about as far as 541 00:28:57,820 --> 00:28:57,049 UFOs were concerned it could all be 542 00:29:00,730 --> 00:28:57,830 explained 543 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:00,740 despite I think something like almost a 544 00:29:05,470 --> 00:29:02,330 third of the sightings that they had 545 00:29:08,890 --> 00:29:05,480 reported to them it still remained 546 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:08,900 unidentified so tell us a little bit 547 00:29:14,860 --> 00:29:11,330 about your new book plays and one on 548 00:29:18,130 --> 00:29:14,870 what that covers one had quite a bit 549 00:29:23,020 --> 00:29:18,140 about Project Blue Book and dr. Hynek 550 00:29:26,740 --> 00:29:23,030 and dr. Hynek had people knowing 551 00:29:29,890 --> 00:29:26,750 theories scientific writing but I had 552 00:29:34,810 --> 00:29:29,900 personal writing and went out one of his 553 00:29:38,970 --> 00:29:34,820 letters was actually the me and he 554 00:29:42,370 --> 00:29:38,980 seemed a lot different in his 555 00:29:45,669 --> 00:29:42,380 handwritten spontaneous writing the 556 00:29:48,759 --> 00:29:45,679 people that he did any scientific 557 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:48,769 writing he was quite interesting he was 558 00:29:54,070 --> 00:29:52,490 he had a real good sense of humor and he 559 00:30:00,149 --> 00:29:54,080 was just dripping with humor lots of 560 00:30:04,090 --> 00:30:00,159 times and he teased people on things and 561 00:30:06,580 --> 00:30:04,100 but the thing that mainly show you up in 562 00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:06,590 Ian's letters was he was people said he 563 00:30:11,499 --> 00:30:08,570 was sort of like a peacock and he was 564 00:30:12,879 --> 00:30:11,509 just flashy and going out with the UFOs 565 00:30:15,180 --> 00:30:12,889 to get his name in the paper 566 00:30:23,109 --> 00:30:15,190 well he wasn't he was very dedicated 567 00:30:26,109 --> 00:30:23,119 UFOs and he actually would go out on his 568 00:30:27,700 --> 00:30:26,119 own and spend his own money and spend a 569 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:27,710 lot of time even though he was busy 570 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:31,850 investigating UFOs and so I haven't 571 00:30:42,549 --> 00:30:34,850 quite a number of letters and documents 572 00:30:46,330 --> 00:30:42,559 of him the Project Blue Book was set up 573 00:30:49,629 --> 00:30:46,340 to investigate UFOs and there was a 574 00:30:52,389 --> 00:30:49,639 history behind it when UFOs first 575 00:30:55,869 --> 00:30:52,399 appeared the Air Force didn't even exist 576 00:31:01,690 --> 00:30:55,879 and they started by calling it project 577 00:31:04,529 --> 00:31:01,700 saucer and then that turning the project 578 00:31:06,669 --> 00:31:04,539 sign which was a precursor to Blue Book 579 00:31:11,230 --> 00:31:06,679 project science seemingly quite 580 00:31:14,399 --> 00:31:11,240 scientific and they explored the idea in 581 00:31:17,259 --> 00:31:14,409 a number of places and wrote it up that 582 00:31:21,549 --> 00:31:17,269 these might be from another planet and 583 00:31:23,409 --> 00:31:21,559 they actually seriously explored it they 584 00:31:26,379 --> 00:31:23,419 explored everything and it just in a 585 00:31:28,629 --> 00:31:26,389 real scientific way of telling people 586 00:31:32,879 --> 00:31:28,639 they get witnesses trying to get things 587 00:31:38,669 --> 00:31:32,889 on radio radar and everything else and 588 00:31:42,609 --> 00:31:38,679 they put out one report that said that 589 00:31:45,669 --> 00:31:42,619 the UFO phenomena is probably from 590 00:31:47,289 --> 00:31:45,679 another planet and that report just disa 591 00:31:49,779 --> 00:31:47,299 that was a government report that 592 00:31:53,739 --> 00:31:49,789 totally disappeared and there's not a 593 00:31:55,899 --> 00:31:53,749 trace of any place then later they 594 00:31:58,779 --> 00:31:55,909 started another project called project 595 00:32:02,320 --> 00:31:58,789 and grudge missiles when people decided 596 00:32:07,570 --> 00:32:02,330 that they would debunk UFOs 597 00:32:09,340 --> 00:32:07,580 and so they had a debunking agency which 598 00:32:12,310 --> 00:32:09,350 was a lot less scientific than the 599 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:12,320 previous one and later they kept on 600 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:16,010 seeing UFOs regardless of the fact that 601 00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:17,570 the government told everybody to do it 602 00:32:27,060 --> 00:32:20,330 exist and so they started Project Blue 603 00:32:31,500 --> 00:32:27,070 Book and this was I think it started 604 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:31,510 1952 and it went until nineteen until 605 00:32:44,500 --> 00:32:39,370 1969 and they collected an awful lot of 606 00:32:48,370 --> 00:32:44,510 sighting reports I think around 13,000 607 00:32:54,190 --> 00:32:48,380 and they also investigated ways to 608 00:32:55,900 --> 00:32:54,200 analyze these reports people just think 609 00:32:58,150 --> 00:32:55,910 of Project Blue by this collecting 610 00:33:00,790 --> 00:32:58,160 reports and that's what normally the 611 00:33:04,950 --> 00:33:00,800 media shows us people collecting them 612 00:33:08,590 --> 00:33:04,960 and the events that happen but um I 613 00:33:11,410 --> 00:33:08,600 worked at Mattel and they had what was 614 00:33:14,790 --> 00:33:11,420 at that time a very secret study where 615 00:33:19,540 --> 00:33:14,800 they analyzed the reports and they had 616 00:33:24,460 --> 00:33:19,550 people designed a questionnaire in such 617 00:33:27,700 --> 00:33:24,470 a way that they could want quantify what 618 00:33:28,900 --> 00:33:27,710 people were seeing such as estimating 619 00:33:32,740 --> 00:33:28,910 how long 620 00:33:35,620 --> 00:33:32,750 the object was in sight such as less 621 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:35,630 than minute between 6 and 10 minutes and 622 00:33:42,430 --> 00:33:37,610 things like that in the color and real 623 00:33:44,790 --> 00:33:42,440 discreet things that anybody could um it 624 00:33:47,140 --> 00:33:44,800 wouldn't be hard for people to 625 00:33:50,530 --> 00:33:47,150 understand such as how many objects do 626 00:33:53,700 --> 00:33:50,540 you see it once things like that and so 627 00:33:57,700 --> 00:33:53,710 they took all that information and 628 00:34:01,780 --> 00:33:57,710 sorted out what was the best and they 629 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:01,790 turned out with about 3100 reports that 630 00:34:09,780 --> 00:34:05,090 were cold from all that and of those I 631 00:34:14,499 --> 00:34:09,790 think about 31% or something were 632 00:34:21,159 --> 00:34:18,279 sir sorry Irina em what I'm just going 633 00:34:23,769 --> 00:34:21,169 to ask was you know I noticed of course 634 00:34:26,289 --> 00:34:23,779 we I mean we all know him as the father 635 00:34:28,779 --> 00:34:26,299 of their of ufology a nine who was a 636 00:34:31,029 --> 00:34:28,789 chief you of her proponent as you point 637 00:34:33,819 --> 00:34:31,039 out in in sacred corridors I think it's 638 00:34:36,489 --> 00:34:33,829 in Chapter 12 and as we know he work for 639 00:34:39,159 --> 00:34:36,499 Blue Book but it was aware wasn't see 640 00:34:42,190 --> 00:34:39,169 that all the really interesting reports 641 00:34:44,730 --> 00:34:42,200 were actually been siphoned off and as 642 00:34:47,230 --> 00:34:44,740 you say they were taken to a patel and 643 00:34:49,389 --> 00:34:47,240 but he was aware wasn't to that blue 644 00:34:52,450 --> 00:34:49,399 book was not a serious scientific study 645 00:34:55,059 --> 00:34:52,460 really was a public relations exercise 646 00:34:57,220 --> 00:34:55,069 just to keep people quiet really well 647 00:35:00,579 --> 00:34:57,230 that's how he started he started lady 648 00:35:02,620 --> 00:35:00,589 bunker there's more to it than people 649 00:35:06,940 --> 00:35:02,630 know because I had I had some more 650 00:35:12,249 --> 00:35:06,950 information and put in the book but he 651 00:35:15,130 --> 00:35:12,259 was contacted by Blue Book and he said 652 00:35:16,630 --> 00:35:15,140 oh it's all nothing UFOs don't exist in 653 00:35:19,479 --> 00:35:16,640 everything because he was a scientist 654 00:35:21,849 --> 00:35:19,489 and he had to have data and everything 655 00:35:25,509 --> 00:35:21,859 and so he became their deep bunker and 656 00:35:27,339 --> 00:35:25,519 whenever they wanted any to debunk a 657 00:35:29,979 --> 00:35:27,349 sighting they just rolled him out and he 658 00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:29,989 debunked it but after a while he started 659 00:35:35,499 --> 00:35:32,170 getting real serious about it and 660 00:35:39,579 --> 00:35:35,509 finding out that there was a lot more to 661 00:35:42,309 --> 00:35:39,589 it than just the people crazy people 662 00:35:44,620 --> 00:35:42,319 gotten seen UFOs because a lot of really 663 00:35:46,289 --> 00:35:44,630 responsible people saw him there are 664 00:35:48,819 --> 00:35:46,299 multiple witnesses they were 665 00:35:50,979 --> 00:35:48,829 high-caliber witnesses such as airplane 666 00:35:55,529 --> 00:35:50,989 pilots they were radar sightings 667 00:36:00,670 --> 00:35:55,539 everything else and so he very slowly 668 00:36:03,579 --> 00:36:00,680 with a big bump changed his mind and 669 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:03,589 became the top proponent for studying 670 00:36:09,970 --> 00:36:07,970 UFOs in a scientific way so what was it 671 00:36:13,180 --> 00:36:09,980 about him them that because I know that 672 00:36:16,150 --> 00:36:13,190 you're describing in in Chapter 12 in 673 00:36:19,210 --> 00:36:16,160 sick sacred corridors and you describe 674 00:36:21,579 --> 00:36:19,220 him as a hero what was it about him then 675 00:36:24,609 --> 00:36:21,589 that made you think like that about him 676 00:36:26,990 --> 00:36:24,619 he was a hero before I ever knew you 677 00:36:30,279 --> 00:36:27,000 opposed because he lived 678 00:36:34,180 --> 00:36:30,289 he worked at Ohio State University and 679 00:36:37,069 --> 00:36:34,190 he wrote a common astronomy column in 680 00:36:39,829 --> 00:36:37,079 the local newspaper the Columbus 681 00:36:43,039 --> 00:36:39,839 Dispatch and I was very interested in 682 00:36:46,309 --> 00:36:43,049 astronomy I tried to get into it I was a 683 00:36:50,150 --> 00:36:46,319 female I didn't get into it but I felt 684 00:36:54,549 --> 00:36:50,160 his strongly columns practically from 685 00:36:56,809 --> 00:36:54,559 when I started being able to read and I 686 00:36:58,430 --> 00:36:56,819 was real interested in telling what's a 687 00:37:01,039 --> 00:36:58,440 hero from that just because it was 688 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:01,049 astronomer and I you know never heard of 689 00:37:05,289 --> 00:37:02,970 didn't know much about science or 690 00:37:10,670 --> 00:37:05,299 anything mm-hmm 691 00:37:12,500 --> 00:37:10,680 so so go ahead fill gone okay I mean one 692 00:37:15,410 --> 00:37:12,510 of the things we touched upon again in 693 00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:15,420 your new book sacred corridors is is 694 00:37:22,970 --> 00:37:19,010 again some more information about 695 00:37:25,579 --> 00:37:22,980 Roswell and and wright-patterson Air 696 00:37:28,099 --> 00:37:25,589 Force Base a legendary place as far as 697 00:37:32,809 --> 00:37:28,109 you follow Jesus concerned is it no 698 00:37:36,260 --> 00:37:32,819 Irina it's the legendary place because 699 00:37:40,730 --> 00:37:36,270 it was where everybody thinks it rose 700 00:37:43,430 --> 00:37:40,740 was a big deal but the story is the 701 00:37:46,609 --> 00:37:43,440 Roslin material went to wright-patterson 702 00:37:48,769 --> 00:37:46,619 and that swert was stored and analyzed 703 00:37:51,559 --> 00:37:48,779 and everything and also wright-patterson 704 00:37:55,700 --> 00:37:51,569 with the home of Project Blue Book so it 705 00:38:00,140 --> 00:37:55,710 was just the top agency for UFOs in the 706 00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:00,150 world so what did you income or anything 707 00:38:05,269 --> 00:38:03,450 that what would will put any credence to 708 00:38:12,230 --> 00:38:05,279 the orders it still remained just a 709 00:38:16,309 --> 00:38:12,240 legend arena wright-patterson is very 710 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:16,319 very very secure and you can't just walk 711 00:38:21,829 --> 00:38:18,210 in I mean it's supposed to be the mecca 712 00:38:24,799 --> 00:38:21,839 of UFOs but you can't walk into it there 713 00:38:26,930 --> 00:38:24,809 do it get into it all probably about 714 00:38:33,549 --> 00:38:26,940 three people or three or four people 715 00:38:36,549 --> 00:38:33,559 have ever been in a secure area and so 716 00:38:40,430 --> 00:38:36,559 the rest of the authors and things who 717 00:38:44,720 --> 00:38:40,440 reported on informants 718 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:44,730 in side and saw things and then told 719 00:38:52,100 --> 00:38:49,530 them about it but I another the person 720 00:38:57,700 --> 00:38:52,110 actually been inside even the most 721 00:39:00,290 --> 00:38:57,710 secure area and there's a lot of stories 722 00:39:03,500 --> 00:39:00,300 they actually there's actually proof 723 00:39:08,950 --> 00:39:03,510 that they sent material from Roswell to 724 00:39:15,820 --> 00:39:08,960 wright-patterson because they had a 725 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:15,830 person on the radio reporting on the 726 00:39:21,970 --> 00:39:20,010 subject in the airplane was what was 727 00:39:27,950 --> 00:39:21,980 taking the material to wright-patterson 728 00:39:30,860 --> 00:39:27,960 Roswell and the man stopped right in the 729 00:39:34,390 --> 00:39:30,870 middle of his talk on the radio and said 730 00:39:38,300 --> 00:39:35,780 wright-patterson 731 00:39:40,100 --> 00:39:38,310 it said they're on their way but they 732 00:39:42,110 --> 00:39:40,110 haven't landed yet and that's pretty 733 00:39:47,720 --> 00:39:42,120 hard evidence so they actually sent 734 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:47,730 something so afterwards there's a lot of 735 00:39:54,140 --> 00:39:51,450 stories about where the debris was in 736 00:39:56,870 --> 00:39:54,150 the UFO and there's stories that they 737 00:39:59,770 --> 00:39:56,880 found that there were bodies or cadavers 738 00:40:04,010 --> 00:39:59,780 from it and all these stories about 739 00:40:07,790 --> 00:40:04,020 where the airplane landed where it 740 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:07,800 unloaded before the bodies and the 741 00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:11,090 breeze went and a lot of other things 742 00:40:18,590 --> 00:40:15,330 and so being I was lucky enough to be on 743 00:40:23,030 --> 00:40:18,600 to be on base several times which nobody 744 00:40:29,270 --> 00:40:23,040 is well there was a there was a story 745 00:40:32,170 --> 00:40:29,280 about Goldwater and that he he was a 746 00:40:35,990 --> 00:40:32,180 presidential candidate and he had 747 00:40:39,170 --> 00:40:36,000 contacted a general general LeMay about 748 00:40:41,420 --> 00:40:39,180 that he wanted to get on get into 749 00:40:44,540 --> 00:40:41,430 wright-patterson and see the UFO 750 00:40:48,980 --> 00:40:44,550 material and LeMay really were really 751 00:40:51,830 --> 00:40:48,990 rebuffed him and also I think J Edgar 752 00:40:54,410 --> 00:40:51,840 Hoover and maybe it was Roosevelt or 753 00:41:01,099 --> 00:40:54,420 something also one he wanted to go 754 00:41:04,039 --> 00:41:01,109 and they weren't allowed in and C Smith 755 00:41:07,130 --> 00:41:04,049 and Kerry recently tried to get in him 756 00:41:09,230 --> 00:41:07,140 and we're allowed to get in so I was 757 00:41:11,690 --> 00:41:09,240 really lucky because my employer had 758 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:11,700 sent me once and I had the pass to go 759 00:41:17,029 --> 00:41:15,210 over the base and then the archivist 760 00:41:24,589 --> 00:41:17,039 showed me all over the base and clearing 761 00:41:28,549 --> 00:41:24,599 the top most secret areas but so I could 762 00:41:31,069 --> 00:41:28,559 actually go in and look at and analyze 763 00:41:34,549 --> 00:41:31,079 some of the things their stories are 764 00:41:40,539 --> 00:41:34,559 about I wasn't in a room with bodies or 765 00:41:47,059 --> 00:41:42,950 crypts and bolts are supposed to be that 766 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:47,069 contained debris and bodies and all that 767 00:41:54,470 --> 00:41:51,410 and the first thing that they did 768 00:41:58,430 --> 00:41:54,480 probably one of most famous things is 769 00:42:02,180 --> 00:41:58,440 hang the hangar 18 stories and this is 770 00:42:05,150 --> 00:42:02,190 either that they analyzed the debris up 771 00:42:09,529 --> 00:42:05,160 in something called the hangar 18 where 772 00:42:11,900 --> 00:42:09,539 that's work was unloaded and in my 773 00:42:15,500 --> 00:42:11,910 information that's different from others 774 00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:15,510 because I had talked to somebody that a 775 00:42:19,789 --> 00:42:16,770 long time 776 00:42:22,789 --> 00:42:19,799 Dayton resident and he said that hangar 777 00:42:28,730 --> 00:42:22,799 18 was actually in his group of hangars 778 00:42:31,059 --> 00:42:28,740 and a series of about five hangars 779 00:42:36,319 --> 00:42:31,069 together and he pointed up which one and 780 00:42:39,950 --> 00:42:36,329 said that the airplane unloaded into 781 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:39,960 that hangar why was on basin and took 782 00:42:46,089 --> 00:42:42,410 some pictures of it and you can see it 783 00:42:48,799 --> 00:42:46,099 distantly from Puffs basement it was 784 00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:48,809 it's just a regular hanger but 785 00:42:55,430 --> 00:42:50,970 apparently might have been called hangar 786 00:43:02,569 --> 00:42:55,440 18 back then and back then when Russell 787 00:43:06,589 --> 00:43:02,579 occurred it was it was off the actual 788 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:06,599 run/walk Bay from right field and so it 789 00:43:10,460 --> 00:43:07,770 looked like it would 790 00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:10,470 in a place where they would end them and 791 00:43:23,540 --> 00:43:12,810 elude the degree I mean was historically 792 00:43:26,390 --> 00:43:23,550 correct it was unloaded from a b-29 I 793 00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:26,400 think she may remember that from an 794 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:29,370 airplane and they had an airplane 795 00:43:33,620 --> 00:43:31,890 actually on this flight near the near 796 00:43:36,890 --> 00:43:33,630 where the old runway wasn't so I took a 797 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:36,900 picture and I also just sort of a joke 798 00:43:43,660 --> 00:43:39,330 said maybe that's the actual plane 799 00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:43,670 roughly Russell material in because it 800 00:43:50,660 --> 00:43:46,290 was that type of plane they were so all 801 00:43:54,050 --> 00:43:50,670 right Adamson so it might have unloaded 802 00:43:55,850 --> 00:43:54,060 at that hangar 1 of the series of 803 00:43:58,220 --> 00:43:55,860 hangars because they were the hangars by 804 00:44:00,440 --> 00:43:58,230 the runway back then the runway isn't 805 00:44:05,930 --> 00:44:00,450 there now but there's still Park a lot 806 00:44:11,060 --> 00:44:05,940 of planes nearly hangars the other story 807 00:44:13,580 --> 00:44:11,070 another story is is that the debris and 808 00:44:20,890 --> 00:44:13,590 possible bodies were taken to building 809 00:44:26,410 --> 00:44:20,900 18 and building right next to it 23 and 810 00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:26,420 then the story is that it was taken to 811 00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:29,850 building 23 and for some reason they 812 00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:32,610 removed the floor and put the debris in 813 00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:36,690 it covered it up and then there's the 814 00:44:44,750 --> 00:44:40,410 building 18 right beside and the story 815 00:44:47,090 --> 00:44:44,760 is that they dug a chain underground 816 00:44:50,380 --> 00:44:47,100 chamber between two buildings and that 817 00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:50,390 some of the material was in going 18 818 00:44:55,700 --> 00:44:53,970 which they also called hangar 18 why 819 00:44:57,560 --> 00:44:55,710 look I did a lot of research on the 820 00:45:00,680 --> 00:44:57,570 building that had never been a hangar 821 00:45:04,430 --> 00:45:00,690 and it also wasn't biennial runways so I 822 00:45:09,590 --> 00:45:04,440 don't think it was a hangar the story is 823 00:45:12,190 --> 00:45:09,600 is that yeah unknown then see the east 824 00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:12,200 side of building 18 that there was a 825 00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:15,690 underground tunnel that went to the 826 00:45:21,380 --> 00:45:19,530 other building had the debris and I 827 00:45:22,789 --> 00:45:21,390 looked 828 00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:22,799 these buildings and took some pictures 829 00:45:32,839 --> 00:45:27,930 and for a building 18 part of the 830 00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:32,849 basement next to building 23 the windows 831 00:45:39,950 --> 00:45:35,249 were blocked like maybe there was a 832 00:45:42,890 --> 00:45:39,960 chamber there so the story is a put the 833 00:45:46,130 --> 00:45:42,900 some of the debris in building 18 and 834 00:45:49,099 --> 00:45:46,140 some in 23 and of course I couldn't go 835 00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:49,109 out and look because I was afraid I'd be 836 00:45:57,789 --> 00:45:51,690 put in day or something well I did 837 00:46:00,799 --> 00:45:57,799 take pictures yeah I believe as well 838 00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:00,809 Irene in your in your in your new book 839 00:46:07,430 --> 00:46:04,170 sacred corridors you talk about another 840 00:46:09,799 --> 00:46:07,440 potential witness to the Roswell crash 841 00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:09,809 that we perhaps not heard about before 842 00:46:17,569 --> 00:46:13,970 can can we eliminate as on that place 843 00:46:22,249 --> 00:46:17,579 yeah this was any other but this person 844 00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:22,259 has denied the whole story he was a he's 845 00:46:33,769 --> 00:46:27,450 a dermatologist he's retired but I heard 846 00:46:36,410 --> 00:46:33,779 from other people that he had been when 847 00:46:38,950 --> 00:46:36,420 he was young a young doctor he's 848 00:46:42,109 --> 00:46:38,960 definitely a doctor and everything that 849 00:46:44,839 --> 00:46:42,119 he's in the he was in the Army too and 850 00:46:50,089 --> 00:46:44,849 the airports of thing that he was 851 00:46:51,710 --> 00:46:50,099 supposed to get go to Roswell maybe it 852 00:46:56,539 --> 00:46:51,720 was white Patterson I think was was well 853 00:46:58,999 --> 00:46:56,549 and study the outside covering of these 854 00:47:02,359 --> 00:46:59,009 bodies their cadavers or whatever they 855 00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:02,369 work from the crash this woman told me 856 00:47:06,950 --> 00:47:04,410 that and she said he said that in front 857 00:47:08,930 --> 00:47:06,960 of several people but I contacted him 858 00:47:11,630 --> 00:47:08,940 and he said oh no nothing like that 859 00:47:13,190 --> 00:47:11,640 happened and she said maybe he was still 860 00:47:19,220 --> 00:47:13,200 in there security so I don't know that 861 00:47:21,049 --> 00:47:19,230 was just another story he didn't say 862 00:47:26,630 --> 00:47:21,059 anything about what the resulting 863 00:47:32,599 --> 00:47:30,380 so yeah can I um Chris sorry oh sorry 864 00:47:33,990 --> 00:47:32,609 Phil and I'm just going to ask 865 00:47:36,030 --> 00:47:34,000 Arina what white 866 00:47:38,580 --> 00:47:36,040 think the closed project Bluebook down 867 00:47:40,770 --> 00:47:38,590 in 69 what was the main reasoning beyond 868 00:47:43,770 --> 00:47:40,780 that well I couldn't understand that at 869 00:47:46,980 --> 00:47:43,780 all because that seemed to be when they 870 00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:46,990 had the very good data showing that UFOs 871 00:47:57,420 --> 00:47:53,050 exist then and that seemed to really 872 00:48:03,330 --> 00:47:57,430 turn off a lot of government people in 873 00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:03,340 this study to report budget special 874 00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:06,370 report number 14 where they analyzed the 875 00:48:12,780 --> 00:48:10,570 result of all the Bluebook observations 876 00:48:16,110 --> 00:48:12,790 and sightings and everything and it 877 00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:16,120 sistex on them and when they did that it 878 00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:20,290 was highly significant like what they 879 00:48:27,540 --> 00:48:23,290 got was one out of a billion chance that 880 00:48:29,610 --> 00:48:27,550 UFOs are not prosaic like airplanes and 881 00:48:31,530 --> 00:48:29,620 everything would be normal flying if 882 00:48:35,190 --> 00:48:31,540 there's something different this is very 883 00:48:37,350 --> 00:48:35,200 strong proof because in normal sent if 884 00:48:40,260 --> 00:48:37,360 it work you're doing good if you get one 885 00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:40,270 chance out of 100 and this was like i 886 00:48:46,050 --> 00:48:42,610 recalculated it might be one chance out 887 00:48:49,140 --> 00:48:46,060 of a true and just beyond anything you'd 888 00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:49,150 imagine that it showed that UFOs are 889 00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:53,890 real yeah so obviously we now know 890 00:48:57,900 --> 00:48:55,510 obviously with with the passage of time 891 00:49:01,290 --> 00:48:57,910 that they closed it down then of course 892 00:49:06,090 --> 00:49:01,300 I think it was December the 16th lost 893 00:49:09,780 --> 00:49:06,100 17th and 2017 we had the New York Times 894 00:49:12,150 --> 00:49:09,790 article and pointing out that that the 895 00:49:14,070 --> 00:49:12,160 American government had secretly being 896 00:49:17,340 --> 00:49:14,080 carried on carrying on you know 897 00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:17,350 investigating UFO reports you know with 898 00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:20,890 this this research project that been 899 00:49:26,520 --> 00:49:23,890 doing for several years and I mean was 900 00:49:28,890 --> 00:49:26,530 that any surprise to you know there was 901 00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:28,900 probably something going on the whole 902 00:49:33,930 --> 00:49:31,810 time when they closed down Blue Book I 903 00:49:36,420 --> 00:49:33,940 think they were still studying UFOs in 904 00:49:38,490 --> 00:49:36,430 some really secret place I mean this 905 00:49:41,270 --> 00:49:38,500 study was they tried to keep it secret 906 00:49:44,100 --> 00:49:41,280 but there were leakers and it got out 907 00:49:47,529 --> 00:49:44,110 but I think they just took a really 908 00:49:52,700 --> 00:49:49,969 some people some compartment of the 909 00:49:54,289 --> 00:49:52,710 government probably it was still 910 00:49:57,279 --> 00:49:54,299 investigating because I think they were 911 00:50:02,150 --> 00:49:57,289 still taking reports from the military 912 00:50:05,359 --> 00:50:02,160 yeah and so I think for a long time 913 00:50:07,930 --> 00:50:05,369 they've investigated and my experience 914 00:50:12,019 --> 00:50:07,940 working for the DIA made me think so too 915 00:50:15,559 --> 00:50:12,029 but it's very very buried in older 916 00:50:18,380 --> 00:50:15,569 secrecy and early in everything of 917 00:50:21,259 --> 00:50:18,390 course yeah they're not going to they're 918 00:50:22,609 --> 00:50:21,269 not going to you know say a UFO project 919 00:50:24,620 --> 00:50:22,619 number one they're not going to put all 920 00:50:26,210 --> 00:50:24,630 that that kind of title in the 921 00:50:28,509 --> 00:50:26,220 information that we give out or that the 922 00:50:31,069 --> 00:50:28,519 star elsewhere you know they're going to 923 00:50:32,779 --> 00:50:31,079 call it completely something different 924 00:50:35,059 --> 00:50:32,789 as they did with this project that we're 925 00:50:37,099 --> 00:50:35,069 just talking about you know that to the 926 00:50:37,849 --> 00:50:37,109 Stars Academy is kind of like come out 927 00:50:40,279 --> 00:50:37,859 of as well 928 00:50:42,319 --> 00:50:40,289 and you know they're going to add it in 929 00:50:46,670 --> 00:50:42,329 the deepest fall they can probably find 930 00:50:48,170 --> 00:50:46,680 and what do you think it's going to 931 00:50:50,499 --> 00:50:48,180 happen in the future do you think we're 932 00:50:54,339 --> 00:50:50,509 going to get a disclosure of some can 933 00:50:57,440 --> 00:50:54,349 well I've been thinking about that and 934 00:50:59,660 --> 00:50:57,450 disclosure in this case involves two 935 00:51:01,459 --> 00:50:59,670 parties it involves the government 936 00:51:04,759 --> 00:51:01,469 whatever government knows the most about 937 00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:04,769 but it also involves the UFO phenomenon 938 00:51:11,809 --> 00:51:10,170 and I think I mean I may be wrong on 939 00:51:15,739 --> 00:51:11,819 this but I think that the government 940 00:51:17,930 --> 00:51:15,749 disclosed everything they knew if they 941 00:51:21,559 --> 00:51:17,940 didn't have real strong proof of UFOs 942 00:51:23,870 --> 00:51:21,569 nobody believed it and so it seemed to 943 00:51:27,019 --> 00:51:23,880 me like it would just look real 944 00:51:29,479 --> 00:51:27,029 disclosure would involve that UFOs being 945 00:51:33,049 --> 00:51:29,489 involved in disclosing themselves too 946 00:51:35,539 --> 00:51:33,059 because probably still kind of data and 947 00:51:37,819 --> 00:51:35,549 said all this and this and this but you 948 00:51:40,969 --> 00:51:37,829 can't make a UFO land on the White House 949 00:51:45,890 --> 00:51:40,979 or something so you didn't really prove 950 00:51:47,779 --> 00:51:45,900 it so if we're talking about your 951 00:51:51,170 --> 00:51:47,789 governments and in government secrecy 952 00:51:53,269 --> 00:51:51,180 etc what do you think of the mj-12 that 953 00:51:57,019 --> 00:51:53,279 the majestic 12 do you think that's a 954 00:52:00,800 --> 00:51:57,029 fact or is it a fiction well it seems I 955 00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:00,810 mean I sort of heard about all along 956 00:52:05,420 --> 00:52:02,130 well I didn't pay any attention to it 957 00:52:10,190 --> 00:52:05,430 all because there was no confirmation or 958 00:52:13,900 --> 00:52:10,200 way to validate anything and I it one 959 00:52:18,250 --> 00:52:13,910 way it started was that they found a 960 00:52:21,890 --> 00:52:18,260 secret document in the National Archives 961 00:52:26,060 --> 00:52:21,900 but it what didn't have an accession 962 00:52:28,250 --> 00:52:26,070 number and so if I thought if somebody 963 00:52:30,500 --> 00:52:28,260 found that they should go to the 964 00:52:33,350 --> 00:52:30,510 archivist and say is this document real 965 00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:33,360 and find out whether it was real 966 00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:35,610 document that nobody did somebody 967 00:52:41,210 --> 00:52:38,370 forgotten to stamp a number on or 968 00:52:42,980 --> 00:52:41,220 whether somebody places it there and it 969 00:52:45,740 --> 00:52:42,990 seemed like write to this at the start 970 00:52:48,740 --> 00:52:45,750 they should have found out that but they 971 00:52:51,380 --> 00:52:48,750 didn't and so things multiplied and 972 00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:51,390 multiplied multiplied but there was 973 00:52:56,420 --> 00:52:53,850 never any real documentation to prove 974 00:52:59,060 --> 00:52:56,430 any of it was right that I can see I 975 00:53:04,190 --> 00:52:59,070 mean it was very well done by the 976 00:53:10,070 --> 00:53:04,200 government or some places was giving out 977 00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:10,080 all this information but apparently 978 00:53:14,900 --> 00:53:12,330 maybe the government was just spending a 979 00:53:17,300 --> 00:53:14,910 lot of energy putting out fake 980 00:53:24,620 --> 00:53:17,310 government mm-hmm I mean fake documents 981 00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:24,630 or something yeah so yeah oh sorry you 982 00:53:28,940 --> 00:53:26,010 know I mean one of the things I was 983 00:53:30,590 --> 00:53:28,950 thinking about I mean it kind of slipped 984 00:53:33,490 --> 00:53:30,600 my mind I don't know how but we've got 985 00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:33,500 another anniversary coming up this year 986 00:53:41,750 --> 00:53:38,130 in 1969 that's the moon landings yeah 987 00:53:43,930 --> 00:53:41,760 and of course one of the things you know 988 00:53:46,910 --> 00:53:43,940 that we've put out regarding your book 989 00:53:49,490 --> 00:53:46,920 and if anybody out there wants to say 990 00:53:51,110 --> 00:53:49,500 anything I would disagree with you here 991 00:53:53,780 --> 00:53:51,120 and now get it over with the map the 992 00:53:58,190 --> 00:53:53,790 moon landings did happen men walked on 993 00:54:00,770 --> 00:53:58,200 the moon and but possible interest in 994 00:54:03,470 --> 00:54:00,780 UFOs why by the man himself by Neil 995 00:54:06,110 --> 00:54:03,480 Armstrong Irena Amick 996 00:54:10,250 --> 00:54:06,120 tell us a bit about that please is there 997 00:54:12,230 --> 00:54:10,260 any substance to this well I I found 998 00:54:14,660 --> 00:54:12,240 something that might be a smoking gun it 999 00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:14,670 might not be but in 1000 00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:20,690 dr. Hynek sledders he told he was on a 1001 00:54:29,810 --> 00:54:26,370 tour of this eclipse I think it which it 1002 00:54:33,050 --> 00:54:29,820 was um there was an eclipse tour with a 1003 00:54:36,830 --> 00:54:33,060 whole lot of really big stars like Isaac 1004 00:54:40,130 --> 00:54:36,840 ants and often um a lot of really famous 1005 00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:40,140 people including Neil Armstrong and in 1006 00:54:47,210 --> 00:54:42,290 one of these layers he mentioned that 1007 00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:47,220 the tour whoever was doing the tour 1008 00:54:53,420 --> 00:54:49,530 calling up and asking that he wanted to 1009 00:54:56,090 --> 00:54:53,430 share a cable you know he ain't spam 1010 00:54:59,600 --> 00:54:56,100 when the shared cable with I'm strong 1011 00:55:02,660 --> 00:54:59,610 and I thought that was interesting I 1012 00:55:05,900 --> 00:55:02,670 looked up how you find out about sharing 1013 00:55:08,240 --> 00:55:05,910 he wants us to share a table you might 1014 00:55:12,410 --> 00:55:08,250 share tables somebody ask you to share 1015 00:55:13,250 --> 00:55:12,420 cable and so possibly Neil Armstrong and 1016 00:55:16,720 --> 00:55:13,260 ask 1017 00:55:20,390 --> 00:55:16,730 Hynek to share a table which would 1018 00:55:23,990 --> 00:55:20,400 suggest that um maybe he was interested 1019 00:55:26,930 --> 00:55:24,000 in UFOs because there were a lot of 1020 00:55:30,050 --> 00:55:26,940 really big shot people there the 1021 00:55:32,780 --> 00:55:30,060 sightings Hynek behind it was maybe a 1022 00:55:35,270 --> 00:55:32,790 little shots appearance it's similar and 1023 00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:35,280 so I thought that was pretty amazing and 1024 00:55:40,670 --> 00:55:38,130 I guess he talked for quite a while but 1025 00:55:44,720 --> 00:55:40,680 there was another some other information 1026 00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:44,730 I had several people told me about this 1027 00:56:00,020 --> 00:55:55,890 that after I'm strong left the Air Force 1028 00:56:04,610 --> 00:56:00,030 of let put being an astronaut he worked 1029 00:56:11,660 --> 00:56:04,620 for a bank in Cincinnati and there's a 1030 00:56:15,130 --> 00:56:11,670 man Liat Leo Stringfield who had 1031 00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:15,140 investigated UFOs and wright-patterson 1032 00:56:21,170 --> 00:56:18,210 I'm in Dayton and he lived in Cincinnati 1033 00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:21,180 and he had written a number of books 1034 00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:24,450 such as situation random status reports 1035 00:56:28,340 --> 00:56:27,330 different things about the bodies and 1036 00:56:33,200 --> 00:56:28,350 everything 1037 00:56:36,260 --> 00:56:33,210 at wright-patterson mainly based on it 1038 00:56:38,300 --> 00:56:36,270 read on information from Florence he 1039 00:56:41,210 --> 00:56:38,310 wrote several books but he had told the 1040 00:56:45,010 --> 00:56:41,220 informant so he wouldn't ever pass out 1041 00:56:49,790 --> 00:56:45,020 their names and so the story was is that 1042 00:56:55,670 --> 00:56:49,800 dr. Hynek and unstrung contacted 1043 00:56:58,190 --> 00:56:55,680 Stringfield and said that they would 1044 00:57:01,880 --> 00:56:58,200 like a list of the names of his 1045 00:57:07,580 --> 00:57:01,890 informants and the Armstrong could get 1046 00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:07,590 it clear Whelan Walton in his bank so 1047 00:57:13,460 --> 00:57:11,370 that Stringfield could say at certain 1048 00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:13,470 time that they could open and there's 1049 00:57:19,850 --> 00:57:15,450 something after he's dead of course and 1050 00:57:23,270 --> 00:57:19,860 he said no but that was another story it 1051 00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:23,280 went with this it suggested that I'm 1052 00:57:30,410 --> 00:57:28,410 strong can used in UFOs I thought you're 1053 00:57:32,290 --> 00:57:30,420 gonna tell us the list of informants and 1054 00:57:46,460 --> 00:57:32,300 his safe-deposit box them for a moment 1055 00:57:50,150 --> 00:57:46,470 Irina in a bank in Cincinnati yeah I 1056 00:57:53,750 --> 00:57:50,160 mean I mean when we talk about the UFO 1057 00:57:56,600 --> 00:57:53,760 cover-up in general I mean what is your 1058 00:57:58,310 --> 00:57:56,610 if I was if I was a skeptic and I came 1059 00:58:00,770 --> 00:57:58,320 to you and said look I don't believe 1060 00:58:02,750 --> 00:58:00,780 there's any UFO cover-up how would you 1061 00:58:04,820 --> 00:58:02,760 convince me that there was what what 1062 00:58:06,950 --> 00:58:04,830 what what could you put in front of me 1063 00:58:09,280 --> 00:58:06,960 there would perhaps help me change my 1064 00:58:14,420 --> 00:58:11,470 [Music] 1065 00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:14,430 so so in reality Phil you're asking for 1066 00:58:20,510 --> 00:58:18,330 the smoking evidence information you 1067 00:58:23,420 --> 00:58:20,520 know just just as we've talked about the 1068 00:58:25,190 --> 00:58:23,430 UFO cover-up it's something that I know 1069 00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:25,200 Irina's covered in this book and our 1070 00:58:30,260 --> 00:58:26,970 last book then it out but in all three 1071 00:58:33,230 --> 00:58:30,270 books so what would convince a skeptic 1072 00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:33,240 that that she was she was right why he 1073 00:58:39,260 --> 00:58:35,610 was terribly terribly terribly boring 1074 00:58:41,750 --> 00:58:39,270 answer I mean science and I would say 1075 00:58:45,260 --> 00:58:41,760 that studying it's our 1076 00:58:50,120 --> 00:58:45,270 14 the Bluebook yeah it found one chance 1077 00:58:55,910 --> 00:58:50,130 of a billion or trillion that UFOs are 1078 00:58:59,510 --> 00:58:55,920 not forsake things because that's done 1079 00:59:04,220 --> 00:58:59,520 scientifically and it's using the 1080 00:59:08,090 --> 00:59:04,230 information that you have and like with 1081 00:59:10,370 --> 00:59:08,100 the mj-12 there's no way to validate it 1082 00:59:12,950 --> 00:59:10,380 and with a lot of other things there 1083 00:59:17,500 --> 00:59:12,960 isn't it 1084 00:59:22,730 --> 00:59:17,510 we didn't report in for example about 1085 00:59:27,070 --> 00:59:22,740 Elroy center from the Mattel who 1086 00:59:30,460 --> 00:59:27,080 reported that he had handled UFO debris 1087 00:59:32,900 --> 00:59:30,470 but yeah I was just word of mouth 1088 00:59:36,620 --> 00:59:32,910 although it was real suspicious because 1089 00:59:40,220 --> 00:59:36,630 this study it was done the SR 14 study 1090 00:59:44,500 --> 00:59:40,230 it was done secretly under Lou what they 1091 00:59:46,850 --> 00:59:44,510 they wanted a psychologist and a 1092 00:59:49,430 --> 00:59:46,860 statistician things like that but what 1093 00:59:52,970 --> 00:59:49,440 they actually hired with metallurgist I 1094 00:59:55,700 --> 00:59:52,980 mean everybody that I knew of in that 1095 00:59:58,610 --> 00:59:55,710 they hired to work on Miller just that 1096 01:00:01,580 --> 00:59:58,620 seemed very very strange that they would 1097 01:00:05,810 --> 01:00:01,590 hire metallurgist to do a study a 1098 01:00:11,780 --> 01:00:05,820 statistical study of UFOs and this one 1099 01:00:15,010 --> 01:00:11,790 man we we heard about he recorded to 1100 01:00:18,530 --> 01:00:15,020 another person tell in the 1950s when 1101 01:00:21,920 --> 01:00:18,540 nobody had ever heard of Roswell or 1102 01:00:26,540 --> 01:00:21,930 anything I think we published it in 1103 01:00:31,330 --> 01:00:26,550 around 1994 or something and then Smith 1104 01:00:34,100 --> 01:00:31,340 and Kerry picked it up and regalia and 1105 01:00:38,390 --> 01:00:34,110 reported in their book in that really at 1106 01:00:41,510 --> 01:00:38,400 the internet about memory metal and all 1107 01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:41,520 that and there's still a lot of articles 1108 01:00:49,730 --> 01:00:46,290 about that as possible showing that they 1109 01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:49,740 actually analyzed material and they 1110 01:00:55,130 --> 01:00:51,690 definitely sent some material from 1111 01:00:56,900 --> 01:00:55,140 Roswell but I don't know 1112 01:01:00,380 --> 01:00:56,910 you know if you don't have the material 1113 01:01:00,979 --> 01:01:00,390 there's no way really smell it yeah just 1114 01:01:03,589 --> 01:01:00,989 word of mouth 1115 01:01:07,690 --> 01:01:03,599 yeah I mean that's one of the curious 1116 01:01:10,519 --> 01:01:07,700 things I find about Roswell in general 1117 01:01:12,710 --> 01:01:10,529 that we're led to believe and I'm not 1118 01:01:15,319 --> 01:01:12,720 I'm not disputing this that it is you 1119 01:01:19,489 --> 01:01:15,329 know a cosmic Walter gate it's a huge 1120 01:01:22,569 --> 01:01:19,499 great cover-up but yet the there is no 1121 01:01:25,249 --> 01:01:22,579 paper trail you know there's not any 1122 01:01:28,509 --> 01:01:25,259 documentation anywhere as far as weren't 1123 01:01:31,190 --> 01:01:28,519 aware of that that's yet has been 1124 01:01:33,140 --> 01:01:31,200 uncovered that would even give us a hint 1125 01:01:35,319 --> 01:01:33,150 you know that would that were on the 1126 01:01:38,180 --> 01:01:35,329 right track 1127 01:01:40,009 --> 01:01:38,190 you know and that puzzles me Irene and 1128 01:01:41,359 --> 01:01:40,019 that really that really puzzles me I'm 1129 01:01:46,009 --> 01:01:41,369 not saying there's anything wrong about 1130 01:01:49,670 --> 01:01:46,019 that H it just puzzles me I mean one of 1131 01:01:55,069 --> 01:01:49,680 the things I asked when it comes to 1132 01:01:58,549 --> 01:01:55,079 Roswell in general we're totally cosmic 1133 01:02:02,319 --> 01:01:58,559 Watergate you know it is the highest you 1134 01:02:05,180 --> 01:02:02,329 know security classification there is 1135 01:02:07,190 --> 01:02:05,190 and if that's correct and they the 1136 01:02:09,710 --> 01:02:07,200 Covenant was put in place within a 1137 01:02:12,589 --> 01:02:09,720 matter of hours because the story went 1138 01:02:15,650 --> 01:02:12,599 out in the Roswell Daily Record and 1139 01:02:17,479 --> 01:02:15,660 within hours that had been pulled and it 1140 01:02:21,349 --> 01:02:17,489 was oops sorry it's it was a weather 1141 01:02:23,120 --> 01:02:21,359 balloon and a bus all of them and would 1142 01:02:25,339 --> 01:02:23,130 ask you the same question Irene that's 1143 01:02:27,979 --> 01:02:25,349 so on I apologize for putting you on the 1144 01:02:30,380 --> 01:02:27,989 spot but my cell on the main Roswell 1145 01:02:34,029 --> 01:02:30,390 researchers like you know Don Schmidt 1146 01:02:37,670 --> 01:02:34,039 Kevin Randle Stan Freedman and so on 1147 01:02:40,700 --> 01:02:37,680 what was it that would cause the powers 1148 01:02:43,839 --> 01:02:40,710 that be to not only put the cover-up in 1149 01:02:49,430 --> 01:02:43,849 place within a matter of hours back in 1150 01:02:52,789 --> 01:02:49,440 1947 but continue that cover-up you know 1151 01:02:55,759 --> 01:02:52,799 to this very day what was it that they 1152 01:02:57,979 --> 01:02:55,769 could recognize that would scare the 1153 01:02:59,900 --> 01:02:57,989 bejesus out of them that would make them 1154 01:03:01,849 --> 01:02:59,910 do that I mean and I couldn't get a 1155 01:03:03,380 --> 01:03:01,859 clear answer and I don't think the fact 1156 01:03:07,059 --> 01:03:03,390 that it was just that it could have been 1157 01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:07,069 from another world was sufficient I mean 1158 01:03:16,220 --> 01:03:10,410 what would you say about that Irena your 1159 01:03:18,559 --> 01:03:16,230 comments me I think at that time the 1160 01:03:21,499 --> 01:03:18,569 Cold War was going one and they were 1161 01:03:23,599 --> 01:03:21,509 very interested in Russia and what it 1162 01:03:25,989 --> 01:03:23,609 was developing wishing up the satellite 1163 01:03:29,569 --> 01:03:25,999 it before we did that certain and 1164 01:03:32,299 --> 01:03:29,579 Germany and to stay here the other 1165 01:03:36,140 --> 01:03:32,309 countries and so if they had something 1166 01:03:38,210 --> 01:03:36,150 they probably would want to keep it 1167 01:03:44,259 --> 01:03:38,220 secret so that the other countries 1168 01:03:49,450 --> 01:03:44,269 wouldn't know about back then but I 1169 01:03:52,789 --> 01:03:49,460 don't know now why it would continue 1170 01:03:55,880 --> 01:03:52,799 except that I hope there may not be any 1171 01:03:59,420 --> 01:03:55,890 way to prove that your bows exist except 1172 01:04:04,009 --> 01:03:59,430 for just the amount of clues it you know 1173 01:04:07,009 --> 01:04:04,019 gives give us and the only way to study 1174 01:04:11,029 --> 01:04:07,019 is this boring study that they did in 1175 01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:11,039 their blue book because I don't think 1176 01:04:16,549 --> 01:04:13,890 they tell if they have I don't know 1177 01:04:18,859 --> 01:04:16,559 anything about anything very definite 1178 01:04:22,309 --> 01:04:18,869 although they do have radar returns and 1179 01:04:25,249 --> 01:04:22,319 everything else they see III look at it 1180 01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:25,259 the other way I mean yes you said that 1181 01:04:33,529 --> 01:04:28,410 the Cold War was just just starting to 1182 01:04:36,799 --> 01:04:33,539 hot up in 1947 and I just I think the 1183 01:04:39,049 --> 01:04:36,809 way politicians work is that they like 1184 01:04:41,390 --> 01:04:39,059 to leave their mark on the in history 1185 01:04:43,009 --> 01:04:41,400 and all that kind of thing I was just 1186 01:04:46,999 --> 01:04:43,019 thinking about the political and 1187 01:04:51,499 --> 01:04:47,009 propaganda useless that could have been 1188 01:04:54,229 --> 01:04:51,509 obtained by the fact that mankind's 1189 01:04:57,279 --> 01:04:54,239 first contact with us 1190 01:05:00,440 --> 01:04:57,289 you know us an extraterrestrial race 1191 01:05:04,609 --> 01:05:00,450 happened in America but not the Soviet 1192 01:05:06,589 --> 01:05:04,619 Union and you could have done all kinds 1193 01:05:09,019 --> 01:05:06,599 of hints yes you could have kept the 1194 01:05:11,180 --> 01:05:09,029 information secret but you could have 1195 01:05:14,930 --> 01:05:11,190 given all kinds of hints they're not we 1196 01:05:17,799 --> 01:05:14,940 got only our own nukes baton weaponry 1197 01:05:21,440 --> 01:05:17,809 but now guess what these guys might be 1198 01:05:24,800 --> 01:05:21,450 turned up with so you know and it just 1199 01:05:26,450 --> 01:05:24,810 bothers me that you know I think that 1200 01:05:29,420 --> 01:05:26,460 the powers that be would have gone the 1201 01:05:31,130 --> 01:05:29,430 other way rather than keep it secret but 1202 01:05:37,329 --> 01:05:31,140 see that's just that's just me I may be 1203 01:05:40,400 --> 01:05:37,339 totally totally wrong as as I can be but 1204 01:05:43,790 --> 01:05:40,410 that that you know that that's just 1205 01:05:46,220 --> 01:05:43,800 something that sticks in my mind I mean 1206 01:05:48,980 --> 01:05:46,230 her net Ana I'm pretty sure if it was 1207 01:05:52,700 --> 01:05:48,990 the cosmic Watergate that that people 1208 01:05:55,310 --> 01:05:52,710 like stamp Tim Freeman espouse under 1209 01:05:58,940 --> 01:05:55,320 this and I'm not saying the wrong there 1210 01:06:01,220 --> 01:05:58,950 must be a paper trail there somewhere 1211 01:06:03,710 --> 01:06:01,230 no the chap was speaking to recently 1212 01:06:06,710 --> 01:06:03,720 about yeah you know Wernher von Braun 1213 01:06:09,770 --> 01:06:06,720 being involved in in the Roswell 1214 01:06:11,930 --> 01:06:09,780 research it would have been the obvious 1215 01:06:14,120 --> 01:06:11,940 mount to bring in you know he was that 1216 01:06:18,109 --> 01:06:14,130 after all the man behind the you know 1217 01:06:20,089 --> 01:06:18,119 the the German V rockets and the man who 1218 01:06:23,540 --> 01:06:20,099 you know was largely responsible for 1219 01:06:25,460 --> 01:06:23,550 putting man on the moon but again up 1220 01:06:27,740 --> 01:06:25,470 said you know we all know about you know 1221 01:06:30,079 --> 01:06:27,750 Operation Paperclip bringing German 1222 01:06:33,950 --> 01:06:30,089 scientists into the country after the 1223 01:06:36,920 --> 01:06:33,960 war but again well you know where is the 1224 01:06:39,559 --> 01:06:36,930 paper trail on you know but he's one 1225 01:06:41,960 --> 01:06:39,569 little document you know I don't know a 1226 01:06:44,390 --> 01:06:41,970 bus ticket of travel you know a train 1227 01:06:46,609 --> 01:06:44,400 ticket a fly anything that shows they 1228 01:06:49,910 --> 01:06:46,619 actually went to Roswell are what was 1229 01:06:52,220 --> 01:06:49,920 anywhere near it and I mean it's just 1230 01:06:57,500 --> 01:06:52,230 not there so while it's not there I 1231 01:07:00,980 --> 01:06:57,510 think it you know again the way I look 1232 01:07:05,059 --> 01:07:00,990 at Roswell is it started off with some 1233 01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:05,069 strange debris you know and I managed to 1234 01:07:10,640 --> 01:07:08,730 meet Mike Jesse Marcel jr. where you 1235 01:07:13,460 --> 01:07:10,650 know talked about the debris is late 1236 01:07:15,710 --> 01:07:13,470 father showed him and it went from some 1237 01:07:18,050 --> 01:07:15,720 strange debris to be in a cosmic 1238 01:07:19,730 --> 01:07:18,060 Watergate you know and I think what 1239 01:07:23,000 --> 01:07:19,740 happened in between it's a bit it's a 1240 01:07:25,450 --> 01:07:23,010 bit like in the UK probably our most 1241 01:07:30,380 --> 01:07:25,460 famous cases the events that happened at 1242 01:07:32,300 --> 01:07:30,390 RAF Bentwaters in Rendlesham forest and 1243 01:07:35,510 --> 01:07:32,310 that went from some strange lights in 1244 01:07:38,539 --> 01:07:35,520 the woods to being a time machine 1245 01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:38,549 you know the future of here on earth 1246 01:07:44,849 --> 01:07:40,930 anything he said well hold on a minute 1247 01:07:47,670 --> 01:07:44,859 what happened in between there and I I 1248 01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:47,680 you know I look at Roswell and another 1249 01:07:51,630 --> 01:07:49,690 cases but certainly the helps to in the 1250 01:07:56,420 --> 01:07:51,640 same light that they've gone from small 1251 01:08:00,210 --> 01:07:56,430 beginnings to become these huge you know 1252 01:08:02,099 --> 01:08:00,220 great events and it puzzles me how 1253 01:08:03,539 --> 01:08:02,109 that's happened it really does I don't 1254 01:08:06,690 --> 01:08:03,549 know about you I mean you know what 1255 01:08:10,890 --> 01:08:06,700 would you say to that well one thing I 1256 01:08:13,349 --> 01:08:10,900 noticed at the tail nets weren't that 1257 01:08:15,210 --> 01:08:13,359 study took place is it several 1258 01:08:18,419 --> 01:08:15,220 presidents of the town 1259 01:08:23,640 --> 01:08:18,429 that should know something about it gave 1260 01:08:27,059 --> 01:08:23,650 positive statements about UFOs and one 1261 01:08:30,079 --> 01:08:27,069 of them that I had my documents here the 1262 01:08:34,410 --> 01:08:30,089 people speculated was Clyde Williams and 1263 01:08:38,120 --> 01:08:34,420 he had been the the president of the 1264 01:08:41,519 --> 01:08:38,130 tell when Russ what happened 1265 01:08:44,519 --> 01:08:41,529 and you would think that if there was 1266 01:08:47,430 --> 01:08:44,529 nothing to it that he would show no 1267 01:08:50,220 --> 01:08:47,440 understand UFOs he would turn down any 1268 01:08:53,789 --> 01:08:50,230 projects on the subject and everything 1269 01:08:58,260 --> 01:08:53,799 else and stead I have documents showing 1270 01:09:02,870 --> 01:08:58,270 that he made quite positive statements 1271 01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:02,880 about UFOs and he approved the study for 1272 01:09:10,039 --> 01:09:05,770 Mattel to do the UFO stuck thing and 1273 01:09:14,370 --> 01:09:10,049 then there's general excellent I'm 1274 01:09:17,220 --> 01:09:14,380 smitten Kerry reported on that said he 1275 01:09:19,079 --> 01:09:17,230 knew about it and um they brought debris 1276 01:09:21,090 --> 01:09:19,089 and bodies and things but he didn't only 1277 01:09:23,999 --> 01:09:21,100 heard about most of the second hand that 1278 01:09:26,309 --> 01:09:24,009 he didn't fly over to the reed field and 1279 01:09:30,539 --> 01:09:26,319 then I found another president of the 1280 01:09:34,169 --> 01:09:30,549 tell who was on the pinnacle man memo 1281 01:09:38,939 --> 01:09:34,179 and that was a leak that showed about 1282 01:09:45,479 --> 01:09:38,949 the s artist 14 study and he didn't he 1283 01:09:49,289 --> 01:09:45,489 was listed the top one on the memo was 1284 01:09:53,519 --> 01:09:49,299 trying to expose this secret SR 14 1285 01:09:57,540 --> 01:09:53,529 and say that when they when the CIA had 1286 01:09:59,220 --> 01:09:57,550 the Robertson panel that they didn't 1287 01:10:01,590 --> 01:09:59,230 have the data that they there wasn't 1288 01:10:04,500 --> 01:10:01,600 ready and they should not have the 1289 01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:04,510 meeting then well they happen the Robert 1290 01:10:13,560 --> 01:10:10,330 semantic panel and that was before they 1291 01:10:15,390 --> 01:10:13,570 agreed that on UFOs don't exist they 1292 01:10:21,450 --> 01:10:15,400 shouldn't be debunked and everything 1293 01:10:24,780 --> 01:10:21,460 else that was when they when they were 1294 01:10:28,830 --> 01:10:24,790 trying to get the results from the SR 14 1295 01:10:32,550 --> 01:10:28,840 study so I had three prevalence of Bikel 1296 01:10:35,850 --> 01:10:32,560 that gave very positive statements about 1297 01:10:39,990 --> 01:10:35,860 UFOs and it should know because they 1298 01:10:42,780 --> 01:10:40,000 were the presidents of dumb the company 1299 01:10:47,550 --> 01:10:42,790 that knew this did a big part of the 1300 01:10:51,650 --> 01:10:47,560 study of Project Blue Book I mean one of 1301 01:10:55,740 --> 01:10:51,660 the things that the mentioning now is 1302 01:10:59,040 --> 01:10:55,750 these further open discussions on an 1303 01:11:02,610 --> 01:10:59,050 official level in in Washington about 1304 01:11:04,620 --> 01:11:02,620 UFOs do you think that might happen you 1305 01:11:08,190 --> 01:11:04,630 know congressional hearings or whatever 1306 01:11:11,670 --> 01:11:08,200 it is you call them especially after 1307 01:11:16,650 --> 01:11:11,680 what came out not last year but the the 1308 01:11:18,960 --> 01:11:16,660 the back end of 2017 in the in the in 1309 01:11:21,030 --> 01:11:18,970 the New York Times do you think that may 1310 01:11:24,420 --> 01:11:21,040 lead to congressional hearings at all 1311 01:11:28,670 --> 01:11:24,430 Irena well I wish they could I don't 1312 01:11:33,090 --> 01:11:28,680 know you see the government so 1313 01:11:35,970 --> 01:11:33,100 compartmentalize that even maybe the 1314 01:11:42,330 --> 01:11:35,980 president couldn't really do anything I 1315 01:11:46,610 --> 01:11:42,340 don't know and it makes me vaguely 1316 01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:46,620 wonder this is ridiculous I know if 1317 01:11:53,010 --> 01:11:50,410 somebody might be well there's been some 1318 01:11:56,730 --> 01:11:53,020 studies that say there's no contact 1319 01:11:59,510 --> 01:11:56,740 between UFOs whatever it is and people 1320 01:12:02,500 --> 01:11:59,520 and whether there might be some 1321 01:12:04,630 --> 01:12:02,510 manipulation of people in the government 1322 01:12:08,250 --> 01:12:04,640 no phenomena there's something too I 1323 01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:08,260 mean I know that's ridiculous no baby I 1324 01:12:15,910 --> 01:12:12,410 mean we see on you can tell us firsthand 1325 01:12:19,780 --> 01:12:15,920 about this I mean we see on you know TV 1326 01:12:22,900 --> 01:12:19,790 shows and movies for example I don't 1327 01:12:25,300 --> 01:12:22,910 quite know how the American police work 1328 01:12:27,580 --> 01:12:25,310 because the police will say it's our 1329 01:12:29,320 --> 01:12:27,590 case and then the FBI or come in and say 1330 01:12:32,170 --> 01:12:29,330 it's not yours anymore it's it's a 1331 01:12:33,670 --> 01:12:32,180 federal case and then somebody else will 1332 01:12:36,820 --> 01:12:33,680 come in and say it's not a federal case 1333 01:12:39,880 --> 01:12:36,830 it's something else and and and it moves 1334 01:12:42,670 --> 01:12:39,890 on the ladder somewhere and none of 1335 01:12:44,350 --> 01:12:42,680 those you know institutions are way 1336 01:12:47,470 --> 01:12:44,360 beyond a call and cooperate with that 1337 01:12:50,050 --> 01:12:47,480 with each other is that is that accurate 1338 01:12:57,070 --> 01:12:50,060 how government departments also work 1339 01:13:00,970 --> 01:12:57,080 Irina I think when you have those first 1340 01:13:04,450 --> 01:13:00,980 came out were the people in project sign 1341 01:13:08,140 --> 01:13:04,460 took a very scientific look at it and 1342 01:13:10,900 --> 01:13:08,150 like I said a document where they the 1343 01:13:13,330 --> 01:13:10,910 the government put out reported that 1344 01:13:15,370 --> 01:13:13,340 UFOs may be from another planet made 1345 01:13:16,990 --> 01:13:15,380 seriously considered that and the whole 1346 01:13:18,610 --> 01:13:17,000 document totally disappeared that was 1347 01:13:25,479 --> 01:13:18,620 before the internet but nobody's ever 1348 01:13:28,780 --> 01:13:25,489 found it again so you don't know at that 1349 01:13:32,080 --> 01:13:28,790 time wright-patterson was considering 1350 01:13:34,000 --> 01:13:32,090 that UFOs might exist they might be 1351 01:13:38,020 --> 01:13:34,010 something that's extraterrestrial 1352 01:13:43,020 --> 01:13:38,030 something very unusual that isn't the 1353 01:13:45,190 --> 01:13:43,030 usual proves a part of our world but the 1354 01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:45,200 other people in the government in 1355 01:13:52,210 --> 01:13:46,850 Washington DC apparently didn't like 1356 01:13:57,790 --> 01:13:52,220 that and just replace the people at sign 1357 01:13:59,950 --> 01:13:57,800 including the bunkers and so I don't 1358 01:14:03,370 --> 01:13:59,960 think the government always agrees with 1359 01:14:07,450 --> 01:14:03,380 each other if different parts of the 1360 01:14:09,160 --> 01:14:07,460 government agree but I don't know how 1361 01:14:14,830 --> 01:14:09,170 you would have pretty how you would go 1362 01:14:16,299 --> 01:14:14,840 about disclosing it if some people had 1363 01:14:19,059 --> 01:14:16,309 really good ever 1364 01:14:22,389 --> 01:14:19,069 I don't know I mean you're an academic 1365 01:14:26,349 --> 01:14:22,399 you know with you you you you you 1366 01:14:28,479 --> 01:14:26,359 masters in a PhD and what have you so 1367 01:14:31,349 --> 01:14:28,489 you you know as a profession you have 1368 01:14:35,439 --> 01:14:31,359 obviously mixed in the academic world 1369 01:14:38,439 --> 01:14:35,449 how was your interest in UFOs being 1370 01:14:41,199 --> 01:14:38,449 looked upon by your colleagues people 1371 01:14:43,209 --> 01:14:41,209 you've worked with other academics how 1372 01:14:46,509 --> 01:14:43,219 you know I'm with how would that come 1373 01:14:49,719 --> 01:14:46,519 across well I didn't go around saying I 1374 01:14:51,459 --> 01:14:49,729 see UFOs because I knew what would 1375 01:14:53,649 --> 01:14:51,469 happen with some people I worked with 1376 01:14:56,889 --> 01:14:53,659 Vince by now I was in UFOs and I got 1377 01:14:59,099 --> 01:14:56,899 harassed a lot but surprising enough 1378 01:15:02,169 --> 01:14:59,109 that's when I was working for the DIA 1379 01:15:04,959 --> 01:15:02,179 where you'd expect it to be military 1380 01:15:09,879 --> 01:15:04,969 guys and you know everybody that he had 1381 01:15:15,579 --> 01:15:09,889 told me bunker I had had my sister and I 1382 01:15:18,009 --> 01:15:15,589 had a real bad experience with UFOs who 1383 01:15:21,189 --> 01:15:18,019 I was working for the DIA and had the 1384 01:15:23,349 --> 01:15:21,199 clearance and everything and I was so 1385 01:15:26,259 --> 01:15:23,359 disturbed I didn't go around saying I 1386 01:15:28,449 --> 01:15:26,269 see UFOs but I went in and said 1387 01:15:30,699 --> 01:15:28,459 something about you know I hear people 1388 01:15:34,299 --> 01:15:30,709 seeing UFOs if something real general 1389 01:15:36,459 --> 01:15:34,309 and that's how I found out that nobody 1390 01:15:38,409 --> 01:15:36,469 laughed at me in my section which was 1391 01:15:40,419 --> 01:15:38,419 err ordered battle we're supposed to 1392 01:15:43,029 --> 01:15:40,429 dance why all the flying off objects 1393 01:15:46,959 --> 01:15:43,039 over a certain area of earth 1394 01:15:51,639 --> 01:15:46,969 and they told me that they had recorded 1395 01:15:53,290 --> 01:15:51,649 a UFO to the government I mean we were 1396 01:15:57,399 --> 01:15:53,300 supposed to be the government people the 1397 01:16:00,879 --> 01:15:57,409 experts that did that and their report 1398 01:16:03,909 --> 01:16:00,889 went up the channels and the higher-ups 1399 01:16:07,869 --> 01:16:03,919 said no they didn't see that it's not on 1400 01:16:10,179 --> 01:16:07,879 the film it's a um um blemish on the 1401 01:16:13,149 --> 01:16:10,189 film or something and it was on two 1402 01:16:15,969 --> 01:16:13,159 different missions so it could've been a 1403 01:16:18,579 --> 01:16:15,979 blemish on the film and that sort of 1404 01:16:22,569 --> 01:16:18,589 convinced I mean made me think that way 1405 01:16:24,879 --> 01:16:22,579 up high in the government but somebody's 1406 01:16:26,979 --> 01:16:24,889 paying a lot of attention to UFOs 1407 01:16:30,160 --> 01:16:26,989 because we were just treated like idiots 1408 01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:30,170 I mean I would 1409 01:16:34,120 --> 01:16:32,330 in industry most of my line for now I've 1410 01:16:38,800 --> 01:16:34,130 got every little green man job he can 1411 01:16:41,590 --> 01:16:38,810 think of Irina my colleague used to walk 1412 01:16:43,330 --> 01:16:41,600 around whistling the you know the X 1413 01:16:47,110 --> 01:16:43,340 whilst you and and that kind of thing so 1414 01:16:48,939 --> 01:16:47,120 I was just curious how how we you know 1415 01:16:55,689 --> 01:16:48,949 it would be look to bomb from from an 1416 01:17:00,189 --> 01:16:55,699 academic point of view her ass I mean 1417 01:17:09,880 --> 01:17:00,199 even like my relative sir scientist just 1418 01:17:11,470 --> 01:17:09,890 tell me that's just crazy so just you 1419 01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:11,480 know you Philip just mentioned little 1420 01:17:19,300 --> 01:17:15,730 green men and and the jokes etc now 1421 01:17:22,510 --> 01:17:19,310 wright-patterson is said to be the place 1422 01:17:24,370 --> 01:17:22,520 where little green men a house you know 1423 01:17:26,590 --> 01:17:24,380 they've recovered some from Ross well 1424 01:17:30,400 --> 01:17:26,600 apparently and they took them there and 1425 01:17:33,250 --> 01:17:30,410 them you know I'm quite surprised to 1426 01:17:36,370 --> 01:17:33,260 find it in secret corridors re know that 1427 01:17:39,610 --> 01:17:36,380 you do admit that green men are there 1428 01:17:41,970 --> 01:17:39,620 air at wright-patterson in fact this is 1429 01:17:45,490 --> 01:17:41,980 a fantastic photograph of yourself and 1430 01:17:47,950 --> 01:17:45,500 dr. Bruce Ashcroft and their little 1431 01:17:49,510 --> 01:17:47,960 green men at wright-patterson but just 1432 01:17:51,939 --> 01:17:49,520 before you tell us what those little 1433 01:17:53,680 --> 01:17:51,949 green men are those green men you want 1434 01:17:55,060 --> 01:17:53,690 to tell us about your first experience 1435 01:18:05,380 --> 01:17:55,070 of actually visiting wright-patterson 1436 01:18:08,350 --> 01:18:05,390 we're from our parent wright-patterson 1437 01:18:10,840 --> 01:18:08,360 has an Air Force Museum and it's really 1438 01:18:11,500 --> 01:18:10,850 interesting at wright-patterson is 1439 01:18:14,680 --> 01:18:11,510 worthy 1440 01:18:16,510 --> 01:18:14,690 Wright brothers developed aircraft and 1441 01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:16,520 everything they were bicycle mechanics 1442 01:18:21,100 --> 01:18:18,650 and develop the airplane and they 1443 01:18:23,229 --> 01:18:21,110 actually have airplanes their summer 1444 01:18:27,729 --> 01:18:23,239 first airplanes and their bicycles to 1445 01:18:29,919 --> 01:18:27,739 the sites which Brett Patterson is very 1446 01:18:33,729 --> 01:18:29,929 important in developing all kinds of 1447 01:18:38,650 --> 01:18:33,739 aircraft including the top ones and so 1448 01:18:42,820 --> 01:18:38,660 anyway the the air force museum is open 1449 01:18:43,689 --> 01:18:42,830 to everybody in the public and so my 1450 01:18:48,489 --> 01:18:43,699 sister and I were 1451 01:18:51,669 --> 01:18:48,499 kids and my father mother and baby 1452 01:18:57,069 --> 01:18:51,679 brother went to wreck Patterson to see 1453 01:18:58,600 --> 01:18:57,079 the Air Force Museum and it the roads 1454 01:19:02,139 --> 01:18:58,610 are sort of complicated around there 1455 01:19:04,029 --> 01:19:02,149 somehow my father got lost and we got 1456 01:19:06,100 --> 01:19:04,039 into these a group of buildings 1457 01:19:10,719 --> 01:19:06,110 surrounding us I don't know how we got 1458 01:19:14,100 --> 01:19:10,729 in there but suddenly these about five 1459 01:19:16,870 --> 01:19:14,110 men were out there in military uniforms 1460 01:19:21,069 --> 01:19:16,880 pointing their guns through the window 1461 01:19:23,859 --> 01:19:21,079 at us and they told us to leave and my 1462 01:19:27,810 --> 01:19:23,869 father hardly ever made one instruction 1463 01:19:34,359 --> 01:19:27,820 like that but he decided to leave and we 1464 01:19:36,850 --> 01:19:34,369 survived so that was a bit of a bit of a 1465 01:19:39,370 --> 01:19:36,860 I know yours child but it's a bit of a 1466 01:19:42,069 --> 01:19:39,380 rude awakening what isn't it really you 1467 01:19:44,620 --> 01:19:42,079 know it's quite strange how you ended up 1468 01:19:48,250 --> 01:19:44,630 working there well there's that's why 1469 01:19:51,389 --> 01:19:48,260 people aren't there investigating right 1470 01:19:53,469 --> 01:19:51,399 patterns because nobody can get in and 1471 01:19:55,959 --> 01:19:53,479 yeah I mentioned in my book there was 1472 01:19:59,529 --> 01:19:55,969 another family that write in the parking 1473 01:20:01,479 --> 01:19:59,539 lot of the Air Force Museum the military 1474 01:20:03,639 --> 01:20:01,489 guys came out and made him get out of 1475 01:20:09,279 --> 01:20:03,649 the car the grandmother and mother and 1476 01:20:11,889 --> 01:20:09,289 kids and made him kneel and things like 1477 01:20:15,639 --> 01:20:11,899 that so there's a lot of security and 1478 01:20:18,839 --> 01:20:15,649 once I when I was on base I was cleared 1479 01:20:21,639 --> 01:20:18,849 but once I was just walking around and 1480 01:20:23,979 --> 01:20:21,649 didn't have a chance to get in and stuck 1481 01:20:27,279 --> 01:20:23,989 the camera lens through the chain-link 1482 01:20:28,330 --> 01:20:27,289 fence and took some pictures and just 1483 01:20:31,209 --> 01:20:28,340 like that there was somebody there 1484 01:20:34,629 --> 01:20:31,219 telling me don't do that go away 1485 01:20:37,330 --> 01:20:34,639 so there are security and what was 1486 01:20:39,819 --> 01:20:37,340 really interesting is that I found out I 1487 01:20:41,919 --> 01:20:39,829 was in another person I had been in the 1488 01:20:47,409 --> 01:20:41,929 most secure place ever at 1489 01:20:51,580 --> 01:20:47,419 wright-patterson and that's the it 1490 01:20:55,600 --> 01:20:51,590 started out as for blooper took where 1491 01:20:57,220 --> 01:20:55,610 they had Blue Book in the old books they 1492 01:20:59,500 --> 01:20:57,230 always talked about a 1493 01:21:02,770 --> 01:20:59,510 see I see the air technical intelligence 1494 01:21:06,070 --> 01:21:02,780 Saturday and this was her Project Blue 1495 01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:06,080 Book was later changed its name to FTD 1496 01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:09,850 and 80 I see an FTD are in all the old 1497 01:21:15,070 --> 01:21:13,610 books about wright-patterson UFOs and 1498 01:21:19,740 --> 01:21:15,080 everything because that was the 1499 01:21:26,020 --> 01:21:19,750 investigator it's a gory agency and so 1500 01:21:27,430 --> 01:21:26,030 anyway it evolved and they tore down its 1501 01:21:32,620 --> 01:21:27,440 old building that they built a new 1502 01:21:35,770 --> 01:21:32,630 building and it changed its name and so 1503 01:21:37,840 --> 01:21:35,780 anyway there's a story about like a 1504 01:21:43,870 --> 01:21:37,850 mentioned Goldwater trying to get into 1505 01:21:46,570 --> 01:21:43,880 the wright-patterson and see the Blue 1506 01:21:49,780 --> 01:21:46,580 Room which was supposed to be the place 1507 01:21:53,440 --> 01:21:49,790 where they kept all the UFO information 1508 01:21:58,540 --> 01:21:53,450 and bodies and everything and so anyway 1509 01:22:01,510 --> 01:21:58,550 I was just reading the smitten carry 1510 01:22:07,240 --> 01:22:01,520 about they've identified the Blue Room 1511 01:22:11,830 --> 01:22:07,250 and that was the na s IC building which 1512 01:22:14,760 --> 01:22:11,840 was the the same thing as the AIC after 1513 01:22:17,410 --> 01:22:14,770 change this name several times and 1514 01:22:19,380 --> 01:22:17,420 another person I had actually been in 1515 01:22:21,870 --> 01:22:19,390 there the blue room that nobody 1516 01:22:24,900 --> 01:22:21,880 presidents or anybody else is allowed in 1517 01:22:27,430 --> 01:22:24,910 and that was because we knew the 1518 01:22:31,600 --> 01:22:27,440 archivist and once he took us in there 1519 01:22:34,410 --> 01:22:31,610 to a meeting on UFOs and squirt us but I 1520 01:22:37,660 --> 01:22:34,420 didn't know it was the Blue Room until 1521 01:22:39,580 --> 01:22:37,670 just recently when I read that they 1522 01:22:41,860 --> 01:22:39,590 didn't been identified as a Blue Room 1523 01:22:46,000 --> 01:22:41,870 and boy you wouldn't believe these 1524 01:22:49,330 --> 01:22:46,010 security around that place I can imagine 1525 01:22:51,400 --> 01:22:49,340 so tell us about the real little green 1526 01:22:54,750 --> 01:22:51,410 men then of their of wright-patterson 1527 01:22:57,010 --> 01:22:54,760 what are they how did they get there and 1528 01:23:08,979 --> 01:22:57,020 well just tell us your opinion of them 1529 01:23:09,799 --> 01:23:08,989 well they had German prisoners of war 1530 01:23:12,740 --> 01:23:09,809 there 1531 01:23:14,979 --> 01:23:12,750 it wasn't this cart wasn't pay-per-click 1532 01:23:18,669 --> 01:23:14,989 this was another part really just had 1533 01:23:23,959 --> 01:23:18,679 prisoners of war in different places and 1534 01:23:26,899 --> 01:23:23,969 these prisoners were artistic and they 1535 01:23:31,250 --> 01:23:26,909 were kept in a building where they 1536 01:23:35,089 --> 01:23:31,260 helped with meals and things and so they 1537 01:23:39,470 --> 01:23:35,099 do all these big murals of all these 1538 01:23:41,209 --> 01:23:39,480 creatures all over the walls it was 1539 01:23:44,089 --> 01:23:41,219 pretty interesting someone looked like 1540 01:23:49,010 --> 01:23:44,099 snakes and Dragons and things and one 1541 01:23:51,500 --> 01:23:49,020 place there's a real big opening real 1542 01:23:54,680 --> 01:23:51,510 big doors and right over hovering over 1543 01:23:56,450 --> 01:23:54,690 it with its hands over it this is the 1544 01:23:58,160 --> 01:23:56,460 big monster with a green face and 1545 01:23:59,390 --> 01:23:58,170 everything it was a big ring man wasn't 1546 01:24:02,510 --> 01:23:59,400 a little dream man 1547 01:24:04,669 --> 01:24:02,520 and so artistic display and they're 1548 01:24:06,020 --> 01:24:04,679 trying to preserve it I think the other 1549 01:24:16,850 --> 01:24:06,030 two are gone but they're trying to 1550 01:24:18,740 --> 01:24:16,860 preserve the last one so where do you 1551 01:24:21,500 --> 01:24:18,750 think we're going to go in the future 1552 01:24:23,029 --> 01:24:21,510 tell me tell us what you're going to be 1553 01:24:25,370 --> 01:24:23,039 doing in the future you're writing any 1554 01:24:27,379 --> 01:24:25,380 more books or you're knocking it on the 1555 01:24:28,700 --> 01:24:27,389 edit the three you know you're going to 1556 01:24:30,410 --> 01:24:28,710 finish there were three of you got 1557 01:24:33,589 --> 01:24:30,420 anything else in mind what you're 1558 01:24:37,520 --> 01:24:33,599 planning I'm not planning anything but 1559 01:24:40,459 --> 01:24:37,530 if anything happens is that I think 1560 01:24:45,470 --> 01:24:40,469 should be reported I'll report it 1561 01:24:50,959 --> 01:24:45,480 I just haven't I think I've said what I 1562 01:24:53,060 --> 01:24:50,969 know now and maybe some more things will 1563 01:24:54,950 --> 01:24:53,070 show up or I'll think of something else 1564 01:24:59,919 --> 01:24:54,960 so I just don't know where it's one with 1565 01:25:02,419 --> 01:24:59,929 me from now on are you actively 1566 01:25:06,859 --> 01:25:02,429 investigating UFO reports he still with 1567 01:25:10,609 --> 01:25:06,869 MUFON yes and one I would like to look 1568 01:25:14,930 --> 01:25:10,619 into was is that I mentioned in the book 1569 01:25:20,629 --> 01:25:14,940 this vanadium Corporation of America 1570 01:25:23,570 --> 01:25:20,639 well PhD told me in person that back in 1571 01:25:27,470 --> 01:25:23,580 the around 1950 that 1572 01:25:31,190 --> 01:25:27,480 these that they had received some and so 1573 01:25:34,790 --> 01:25:31,200 full of material that look like dirt and 1574 01:25:40,400 --> 01:25:34,800 some kind of metal and that they wanted 1575 01:25:43,780 --> 01:25:40,410 analyzed and they analyze that and it 1576 01:25:49,670 --> 01:25:43,790 didn't look natural at all look man-made 1577 01:25:50,870 --> 01:25:49,680 and this was about the time when Roswell 1578 01:25:54,260 --> 01:25:50,880 material had been sent to 1579 01:25:56,540 --> 01:25:54,270 wright-patterson and it looked like 1580 01:26:00,980 --> 01:25:56,550 wright-patterson might have farmed out 1581 01:26:04,370 --> 01:26:00,990 other parts of it to places this was an 1582 01:26:07,400 --> 01:26:04,380 alloy company and he said that they 1583 01:26:13,720 --> 01:26:07,410 talked about it and it looked like that 1584 01:26:17,840 --> 01:26:13,730 it was a man-made material at the time 1585 01:26:21,080 --> 01:26:17,850 not night memory metal had not been 1586 01:26:26,270 --> 01:26:21,090 developed and the company was studying 1587 01:26:29,720 --> 01:26:26,280 titanium and there's a lot of stories 1588 01:26:34,000 --> 01:26:29,730 that maybe they develop memory metal 1589 01:26:36,980 --> 01:26:34,010 from that night to know from titanium do 1590 01:26:40,550 --> 01:26:36,990 knowledge about material from either 1591 01:26:46,190 --> 01:26:40,560 Roswell someplace else and this kind of 1592 01:26:48,260 --> 01:26:46,200 fit into that like the the person that 1593 01:26:51,500 --> 01:26:48,270 told me about said they discuss it quite 1594 01:26:54,650 --> 01:26:51,510 a bit and the material was crystalline 1595 01:26:57,350 --> 01:26:54,660 and he told me the composition and he 1596 01:27:01,250 --> 01:26:57,360 said they thought it was manufactured 1597 01:27:03,440 --> 01:27:01,260 and from you know expert from outer 1598 01:27:06,800 --> 01:27:03,450 space or something that wasn't naturally 1599 01:27:09,620 --> 01:27:06,810 man-made material and so I might try to 1600 01:27:12,290 --> 01:27:09,630 investigate that soon or to I mean if 1601 01:27:17,030 --> 01:27:12,300 you if you get over this material Irene 1602 01:27:19,730 --> 01:27:17,040 are some of it I just wondered if you'd 1603 01:27:22,550 --> 01:27:19,740 consider contacting you know to the 1604 01:27:24,560 --> 01:27:22,560 scows Academy to see if there might be 1605 01:27:26,780 --> 01:27:24,570 interested in analyzing it for you know 1606 01:27:32,240 --> 01:27:26,790 would you go your own way with it and IV 1607 01:27:36,140 --> 01:27:32,250 analyzed independently I mean really 1608 01:27:37,459 --> 01:27:36,150 question I just said if if you obtain 1609 01:27:39,350 --> 01:27:37,469 some of this material 1610 01:27:42,350 --> 01:27:39,360 if you can manage to get your hands on 1611 01:27:44,810 --> 01:27:42,360 it would you have it analyzed 1612 01:27:47,299 --> 01:27:44,820 independently or would you perhaps look 1613 01:27:50,419 --> 01:27:47,309 at contacting somebody like to the Stars 1614 01:27:54,469 --> 01:27:50,429 Academy who are apparently you know are 1615 01:27:58,759 --> 01:27:54,479 already testing certain alleged UFO 1616 01:28:00,469 --> 01:27:58,769 materials I think if I had my hands on 1617 01:28:03,969 --> 01:28:00,479 the first thing I'd do is go to a lawyer 1618 01:28:07,580 --> 01:28:03,979 and see how do the most secure possible 1619 01:28:09,739 --> 01:28:07,590 testing and you know there's some way to 1620 01:28:11,750 --> 01:28:09,749 document everything make sure it goes to 1621 01:28:15,109 --> 01:28:11,760 the right people because there's a lot 1622 01:28:16,219 --> 01:28:15,119 of cover-up in the government and all 1623 01:28:19,430 --> 01:28:16,229 over the place 1624 01:28:22,250 --> 01:28:19,440 and you never if you'd have to be really 1625 01:28:24,680 --> 01:28:22,260 careful to make sure it didn't disappear 1626 01:28:26,419 --> 01:28:24,690 or something like that and it seems to 1627 01:28:28,969 --> 01:28:26,429 me like there'd be a sort of a security 1628 01:28:32,870 --> 01:28:28,979 thing immediately to worry about if you 1629 01:28:34,969 --> 01:28:32,880 did get your hands on something I mean 1630 01:28:37,489 --> 01:28:34,979 you know outside of cases you've 1631 01:28:41,169 --> 01:28:37,499 investigated yourself I mean are there 1632 01:28:43,819 --> 01:28:41,179 any standout cases that you know 1633 01:28:46,819 --> 01:28:43,829 convince you that you have not been 1634 01:28:48,739 --> 01:28:46,829 wasting your time that perhaps you know 1635 01:28:55,000 --> 01:28:48,749 I'm not in the mainstream that perhaps 1636 01:29:02,719 --> 01:28:59,270 one thing I found in this material I had 1637 01:29:07,969 --> 01:29:02,729 that I had never heard of is that there 1638 01:29:11,060 --> 01:29:07,979 was a big NATO exercise it was called 1639 01:29:14,689 --> 01:29:11,070 conduct main brain and they had good 1640 01:29:16,910 --> 01:29:14,699 evidence the UFOs had been monitoring 1641 01:29:18,790 --> 01:29:16,920 the whole thing and that involved a lot 1642 01:29:21,290 --> 01:29:18,800 of countries and a whole lot of 1643 01:29:23,000 --> 01:29:21,300 machinery and everything and then later 1644 01:29:25,640 --> 01:29:23,010 they were worried that they were going 1645 01:29:28,040 --> 01:29:25,650 to set out the first hydrogen bomb and 1646 01:29:29,719 --> 01:29:28,050 they actually set things up in 1647 01:29:33,350 --> 01:29:29,729 preparation in case 1648 01:29:34,969 --> 01:29:33,360 UFOs appeared there some way and I 1649 01:29:37,129 --> 01:29:34,979 thought that was a pretty interesting I 1650 01:29:42,370 --> 01:29:37,139 I mean maybe everybody knew about that I 1651 01:29:46,339 --> 01:29:42,380 shouldn't even know about it I think 1652 01:29:50,149 --> 01:29:46,349 what come what convinced me was my own 1653 01:29:55,489 --> 01:29:51,890 and maybe that's the only thing that 1654 01:29:57,830 --> 01:29:55,499 really convinces anybody mmm I would 1655 01:30:00,919 --> 01:29:57,840 agree with you there I mean I mean might 1656 01:30:04,370 --> 01:30:00,929 my thoughts on that on the nature and 1657 01:30:06,919 --> 01:30:04,380 origin of the the subjects have changed 1658 01:30:10,310 --> 01:30:06,929 down the years and what I probably will 1659 01:30:12,199 --> 01:30:10,320 continue to do so but nonetheless I mean 1660 01:30:14,810 --> 01:30:12,209 you know witness a couple of things 1661 01:30:17,799 --> 01:30:14,820 myself you know I'm I have no doubt that 1662 01:30:22,370 --> 01:30:17,809 the phenomenon is real and he's worth of 1663 01:30:23,959 --> 01:30:22,380 further study I have to agree with you 1664 01:30:26,239 --> 01:30:23,969 there yeah I mean you know some people 1665 01:30:28,729 --> 01:30:26,249 say oh I believe UFOs are this and 1666 01:30:30,560 --> 01:30:28,739 that's it but I say you know that's not 1667 01:30:32,929 --> 01:30:30,570 really the way it goes I just keep an 1668 01:30:36,409 --> 01:30:32,939 open mind and I mean the things that 1669 01:30:40,159 --> 01:30:36,419 came out in the New York Times had an 1670 01:30:42,620 --> 01:30:40,169 influence on my my thoughts and you know 1671 01:30:44,569 --> 01:30:42,630 I believe more is to come from that but 1672 01:30:47,270 --> 01:30:44,579 you know that's that's not down to me 1673 01:30:49,580 --> 01:30:47,280 we'll we'll wait and see we're gonna 1674 01:30:52,370 --> 01:30:49,590 round it off in a minute irena just want 1675 01:30:55,040 --> 01:30:52,380 to first thank you for taking your time 1676 01:30:58,299 --> 01:30:55,050 out to speak to us this evening if 1677 01:31:01,729 --> 01:30:58,309 anybody wants to read any of your books 1678 01:31:03,949 --> 01:31:01,739 where can they find them you can look 1679 01:31:08,810 --> 01:31:03,959 down there Irene Scott at the Internet 1680 01:31:10,339 --> 01:31:08,820 or Irene scott calm and the books will 1681 01:31:11,629 --> 01:31:10,349 be listed and you can click on them 1682 01:31:14,479 --> 01:31:11,639 books any one you want 1683 01:31:18,709 --> 01:31:14,489 and that should go right to Amazon calm 1684 01:31:21,350 --> 01:31:18,719 that would be the easy way I mean what I 1685 01:31:24,350 --> 01:31:21,360 will say Irene I think you're three 1686 01:31:28,819 --> 01:31:24,360 books UFOs today inside the lightning 1687 01:31:31,669 --> 01:31:28,829 bolt and and sacred corridors are some 1688 01:31:35,000 --> 01:31:31,679 of the most fascinating books out about 1689 01:31:37,219 --> 01:31:35,010 the the pleasure to read and I think 1690 01:31:40,969 --> 01:31:37,229 wherever they've gone they've always got 1691 01:31:43,159 --> 01:31:40,979 you know a great deal of credit and 1692 01:31:45,049 --> 01:31:43,169 that's all unbiased nothing to do with 1693 01:31:47,709 --> 01:31:45,059 me it's just you know people who have 1694 01:31:51,969 --> 01:31:47,719 picked up your books and read them I 1695 01:31:56,029 --> 01:31:51,979 will say that your books will be also 1696 01:31:58,939 --> 01:31:56,039 your first book UFOs today he's planned 1697 01:32:02,529 --> 01:31:58,949 to begin Russian in the Russian language 1698 01:32:04,220 --> 01:32:02,539 in spring it will be out in Germany 1699 01:32:06,770 --> 01:32:04,230 what's the report 1700 01:32:08,570 --> 01:32:06,780 jeez and it will definitely be your new 1701 01:32:11,630 --> 01:32:08,580 ones will definitely be out in Spanish 1702 01:32:15,140 --> 01:32:11,640 at some point as well cus we've just set 1703 01:32:18,620 --> 01:32:15,150 up flying this press latin america with 1704 01:32:21,530 --> 01:32:18,630 a colleague in argentina so he's gonna 1705 01:32:24,800 --> 01:32:21,540 translate as many of my books of our 1706 01:32:26,720 --> 01:32:24,810 books as he can into Spanish we will 1707 01:32:28,729 --> 01:32:26,730 shortly be announcing this is the first 1708 01:32:32,840 --> 01:32:28,739 day I'm going to mention it find this 1709 01:32:36,460 --> 01:32:32,850 press in France so there's a possibility 1710 01:32:38,840 --> 01:32:36,470 that some of your books may make it into 1711 01:32:42,350 --> 01:32:38,850 French with us as well 1712 01:32:44,630 --> 01:32:42,360 and company called nag verlag you've 1713 01:32:47,150 --> 01:32:44,640 already got your first book in German 1714 01:32:50,270 --> 01:32:47,160 you've actually got copies of that in 1715 01:32:52,400 --> 01:32:50,280 your hands I believe but the gentleman 1716 01:32:54,740 --> 01:32:52,410 who owns that company has taken all our 1717 01:32:57,350 --> 01:32:54,750 books every single book from it from 1718 01:32:59,420 --> 01:32:57,360 flying this price now means that to hire 1719 01:33:04,490 --> 01:32:59,430 some more translators in order to bring 1720 01:33:08,570 --> 01:33:04,500 them out a bit a bit quicker so the the 1721 01:33:10,310 --> 01:33:08,580 the your your work is spreading Irina on 1722 01:33:13,430 --> 01:33:10,320 behalf of Chris and I'm gonna we're 1723 01:33:15,950 --> 01:33:13,440 gonna round it up there for now for the 1724 01:33:19,370 --> 01:33:15,960 evening it's been a great pleasure to 1725 01:33:21,260 --> 01:33:19,380 speak to you and I'm sure it would have 1726 01:33:25,430 --> 01:33:21,270 been the first time I'm sure it will not 1727 01:33:27,800 --> 01:33:25,440 be the last time Irina and you know we 1728 01:33:29,360 --> 01:33:27,810 thank you very much for not taking your 1729 01:33:32,540 --> 01:33:29,370 time out this evening thank you very 1730 01:33:34,970 --> 01:33:32,550 much just before we finish there I just 1731 01:33:37,670 --> 01:33:34,980 like to say Irene enough if people have 1732 01:33:40,460 --> 01:33:37,680 an interest in Wright Patterson in 1733 01:33:42,710 --> 01:33:40,470 Project Blue Book you know these this 1734 01:33:44,690 --> 01:33:42,720 memory metal you really do need to get 1735 01:33:47,210 --> 01:33:44,700 your hands on sacred corridors it is a 1736 01:33:49,910 --> 01:33:47,220 fascinating read and one which I'm going 1737 01:33:51,890 --> 01:33:49,920 to delve into a very very soon Thank You 1738 01:33:54,020 --> 01:33:51,900 Irina thank you both very much I was 1739 01:33:55,729 --> 01:33:54,030 certainly happy to discuss everything 1740 01:33:58,790 --> 01:33:55,739 with you and there's a lot more in my 1741 01:34:01,160 --> 01:33:58,800 book that I didn't cover too so thank 1742 01:34:02,780 --> 01:34:01,170 you well perhaps perhaps we can do 1743 01:34:04,880 --> 01:34:02,790 something and once more you know a 1744 01:34:10,550 --> 01:34:04,890 little bit in the future sometime in the 1745 01:34:11,840 --> 01:34:10,560 future okay thank you very much Irina 1746 01:34:15,229 --> 01:34:11,850 enjoy the rest of your day 1747 01:34:17,180 --> 01:34:15,239 yeah thanks well there you go filled air 1748 01:34:17,950 --> 01:34:17,190 dr. Irina Scott there what do you think 1749 01:34:21,850 --> 01:34:17,960 of that what 1750 01:34:25,360 --> 01:34:21,860 lady well i'm salutely Chris I mean you 1751 01:34:27,250 --> 01:34:25,370 know I remember why breakfast first 1752 01:34:30,910 --> 01:34:27,260 started in this business I look this is 1753 01:34:35,020 --> 01:34:30,920 a long time ago now and there was sort 1754 01:34:38,140 --> 01:34:35,030 of a cry if you like for scientists to 1755 01:34:40,959 --> 01:34:38,150 become more involved with the subject 1756 01:34:43,570 --> 01:34:40,969 there was already one or two but a lot 1757 01:34:46,060 --> 01:34:43,580 of scientists of helped help behind the 1758 01:34:48,160 --> 01:34:46,070 scenes now and again I think for example 1759 01:34:49,959 --> 01:34:48,170 Jack Wailea called it you know the 1760 01:34:51,520 --> 01:34:49,969 secret college or something of that 1761 01:34:55,590 --> 01:34:51,530 nature yeah 1762 01:35:00,250 --> 01:34:55,600 but here you have you know a bonafide 1763 01:35:03,910 --> 01:35:00,260 scientist who has worked in places where 1764 01:35:06,760 --> 01:35:03,920 they officially studied the UFO subject 1765 01:35:09,459 --> 01:35:06,770 and she's not working behind the scenes 1766 01:35:14,440 --> 01:35:09,469 he's she's out in the public and has 1767 01:35:16,090 --> 01:35:14,450 been for quite some time and you know 1768 01:35:19,000 --> 01:35:16,100 I'm not just saying this because I'm I'm 1769 01:35:22,660 --> 01:35:19,010 I'm Irina's publisher but it has been a 1770 01:35:25,570 --> 01:35:22,670 privilege to work with her because I 1771 01:35:27,900 --> 01:35:25,580 think a lot of the information that she 1772 01:35:30,970 --> 01:35:27,910 presents if not all of it 1773 01:35:33,310 --> 01:35:30,980 he's checkable you don't have to believe 1774 01:35:35,920 --> 01:35:33,320 me you know I am a scientist this is 1775 01:35:41,320 --> 01:35:35,930 where I worked there's no dispute for 1776 01:35:44,830 --> 01:35:41,330 example with Irina's CV like that is for 1777 01:35:46,780 --> 01:35:44,840 example Bob Lazar you know yeah you know 1778 01:35:48,910 --> 01:35:46,790 you can check where and she's got the 1779 01:35:51,760 --> 01:35:48,920 photographs to prove it I mean she has a 1780 01:35:54,340 --> 01:35:51,770 photograph of the Green Man inside 1781 01:35:55,990 --> 01:35:54,350 wright-patterson Air Force place it just 1782 01:35:59,680 --> 01:35:56,000 happens to be a painting on the wall 1783 01:36:02,530 --> 01:35:59,690 yeah no no I think Iranian says it was 1784 01:36:04,930 --> 01:36:02,540 it was painted before the the age of the 1785 01:36:06,580 --> 01:36:04,940 UFO if you like but it's a kind of a 1786 01:36:08,530 --> 01:36:06,590 name jerk and there you don't you see 1787 01:36:10,810 --> 01:36:08,540 arena with one of their colleagues and 1788 01:36:13,930 --> 01:36:10,820 you can see see the painting on the wall 1789 01:36:16,360 --> 01:36:13,940 next to them absolutely yes absolutely 1790 01:36:18,220 --> 01:36:16,370 it's it's one of those things in sit 1791 01:36:21,010 --> 01:36:18,230 that yes we want scientists to get 1792 01:36:24,490 --> 01:36:21,020 involved with the subject of UFOs or the 1793 01:36:26,740 --> 01:36:24,500 paranormal itself but we also want more 1794 01:36:29,080 --> 01:36:26,750 ladies involved in the UFO field as well 1795 01:36:30,209 --> 01:36:29,090 I mean the one that comes to mind for me 1796 01:36:33,250 --> 01:36:30,219 is Jenny Randall's 1797 01:36:35,050 --> 01:36:33,260 an acquaintance of yourself but we need 1798 01:36:37,209 --> 01:36:35,060 more people you know Brenda Butler we 1799 01:36:40,090 --> 01:36:37,219 need more people involved with the 1800 01:36:41,740 --> 01:36:40,100 subject more ladies especially well yeah 1801 01:36:44,410 --> 01:36:41,750 and I mean I mean one of the ladies that 1802 01:36:45,610 --> 01:36:44,420 that arena has worked with is a lady 1803 01:36:47,670 --> 01:36:45,620 Kanchana Zeidman 1804 01:36:52,120 --> 01:36:47,680 and Jenny worked you know hand in glove 1805 01:36:55,630 --> 01:36:52,130 with the late dr. Hynek and female 1806 01:36:59,770 --> 01:36:55,640 latest book you know there is a number 1807 01:37:01,840 --> 01:36:59,780 of handwritten letters from Hynek 1808 01:37:04,360 --> 01:37:01,850 that have come you know from from 1809 01:37:06,400 --> 01:37:04,370 Jenny's evenings archives and they're 1810 01:37:09,070 --> 01:37:06,410 fastening the fascinating in their own 1811 01:37:11,229 --> 01:37:09,080 right Chris because this is not you know 1812 01:37:13,660 --> 01:37:11,239 wink-wink nudge-nudge she's there in the 1813 01:37:17,800 --> 01:37:13,670 gentleman's own handwriting for all to 1814 01:37:20,380 --> 01:37:17,810 see and you know purely as a historical 1815 01:37:23,590 --> 01:37:20,390 document if nothing else they are 1816 01:37:25,660 --> 01:37:23,600 absolutely fascinating now of course the 1817 01:37:28,780 --> 01:37:25,670 one lady who stood out for me for many 1818 01:37:32,729 --> 01:37:28,790 years was was delayed Cynthia hind now 1819 01:37:35,410 --> 01:37:32,739 you know Cynthia lived in Zimbabwe and 1820 01:37:39,160 --> 01:37:35,420 people forget that Zimbabwe at the time 1821 01:37:41,530 --> 01:37:39,170 was a communist state on Lobster they 1822 01:37:43,080 --> 01:37:41,540 had currency control for example he 1823 01:37:45,540 --> 01:37:43,090 couldn't take money out of the country 1824 01:37:48,310 --> 01:37:45,550 so I was fortunate enough to meet 1825 01:37:50,140 --> 01:37:48,320 Cynthia on a number of occasions she was 1826 01:37:52,300 --> 01:37:50,150 larger than life in every sense of the 1827 01:37:54,880 --> 01:37:52,310 word she was a large lady and a large 1828 01:37:57,370 --> 01:37:54,890 personality but as soon as she stepped 1829 01:37:59,709 --> 01:37:57,380 outside of Zimbabwe she was pretty much 1830 01:38:02,110 --> 01:37:59,719 penniless because she wasn't allowed to 1831 01:38:04,360 --> 01:38:02,120 bring any money with her yeah this had 1832 01:38:05,950 --> 01:38:04,370 been under the controls of a the Robert 1833 01:38:07,870 --> 01:38:05,960 Mugabe government I should have asked 1834 01:38:10,150 --> 01:38:07,880 that's right and you know and and and 1835 01:38:12,040 --> 01:38:10,160 sadly you know Cynthia had to leave 1836 01:38:15,370 --> 01:38:12,050 Zimbabwe in the end because of the 1837 01:38:16,930 --> 01:38:15,380 policies of of the country and she moved 1838 01:38:19,150 --> 01:38:16,940 to South Africa to live with her 1839 01:38:21,070 --> 01:38:19,160 daughter the reason she came to England 1840 01:38:24,300 --> 01:38:21,080 on occasion is she had a daughter that 1841 01:38:26,620 --> 01:38:24,310 lived here as well and she was a 1842 01:38:28,600 --> 01:38:26,630 fascinating legatee in her own right but 1843 01:38:32,950 --> 01:38:28,610 you you are right you know not just in 1844 01:38:36,100 --> 01:38:32,960 in in in putting other subjects but in 1845 01:38:40,520 --> 01:38:36,110 any subject you know import from the 1846 01:38:42,950 --> 01:38:40,530 female society is sadly lacking 1847 01:38:47,210 --> 01:38:42,960 and certainly is luck in here in the UK 1848 01:38:49,220 --> 01:38:47,220 and that's why I think if we just step 1849 01:38:51,170 --> 01:38:49,230 back a little bit you go back to the 1850 01:38:53,810 --> 01:38:51,180 Saab barely to mid 90s 1851 01:38:54,800 --> 01:38:53,820 he's when dr. John Mack first came out 1852 01:38:57,380 --> 01:38:54,810 of the woodwork 1853 01:38:59,630 --> 01:38:57,390 and what Mac did of course you know 1854 01:39:02,840 --> 01:38:59,640 happy max a Harvard professor who's a 1855 01:39:04,840 --> 01:39:02,850 Pulitzer Prize winning author yeah for 1856 01:39:07,630 --> 01:39:04,850 his work on Lawrence of Arabia and he 1857 01:39:10,640 --> 01:39:07,640 gave the subject an air of credibility 1858 01:39:13,040 --> 01:39:10,650 because this wasn't some crap whap you 1859 01:39:15,110 --> 01:39:13,050 know this was he again he was exactly 1860 01:39:19,250 --> 01:39:15,120 who he said he was and also at the same 1861 01:39:21,140 --> 01:39:19,260 time Nick Pope on The ministers was 1862 01:39:24,560 --> 01:39:21,150 still working at the MLT at that time 1863 01:39:27,350 --> 01:39:24,570 also came to the floor Nick Aziz critics 1864 01:39:29,300 --> 01:39:27,360 whatever you want to say he did the job 1865 01:39:30,800 --> 01:39:29,310 that he said he did you know and I know 1866 01:39:32,540 --> 01:39:30,810 it did it because I'm one of those that 1867 01:39:36,440 --> 01:39:32,550 pestered him while I was doing it you 1868 01:39:39,110 --> 01:39:36,450 know I'm sure he appreciated that now 1869 01:39:41,510 --> 01:39:39,120 talking about dr. Irena Scott again 1870 01:39:43,100 --> 01:39:41,520 air-filled at another this this latest 1871 01:39:44,990 --> 01:39:43,110 publication which came out as we've 1872 01:39:47,630 --> 01:39:45,000 discussed generally the first this year 1873 01:39:49,580 --> 01:39:47,640 and sacred corridors this isn't the 1874 01:39:51,230 --> 01:39:49,590 first one that you've actually published 1875 01:39:52,010 --> 01:39:51,240 for her is that you've actually done a 1876 01:39:55,460 --> 01:39:52,020 couple MA 1877 01:39:58,130 --> 01:39:55,470 well that's it I mean we did one a first 1878 01:40:00,130 --> 01:39:58,140 book once UFOs today again it was about 1879 01:40:03,650 --> 01:40:00,140 the cover-up but that that came out in 1880 01:40:07,280 --> 01:40:03,660 2017 to coincide with the 70th 1881 01:40:10,160 --> 01:40:07,290 anniversary of flying saucers so it's 1882 01:40:14,270 --> 01:40:10,170 part look back and part of her own 1883 01:40:17,360 --> 01:40:14,280 research and he was very well received 1884 01:40:18,460 --> 01:40:17,370 pretty much everywhere you know got 1885 01:40:23,210 --> 01:40:18,470 great reviews 1886 01:40:26,690 --> 01:40:23,220 sold well in that respect it's now for 1887 01:40:30,380 --> 01:40:26,700 example as we speak this it has been 1888 01:40:34,490 --> 01:40:30,390 translated into German it's on the list 1889 01:40:38,150 --> 01:40:34,500 to be translated into Spanish and it's 1890 01:40:41,360 --> 01:40:38,160 been translated into Russian now you 1891 01:40:43,280 --> 01:40:41,370 know which is extremely rare myself and 1892 01:40:46,310 --> 01:40:43,290 Paul Stonehill managed to get one of our 1893 01:40:50,600 --> 01:40:46,320 books published in Russia last year and 1894 01:40:53,900 --> 01:40:50,610 this because Stig Marion they're 1895 01:40:56,030 --> 01:40:53,910 publishing Irina's those 1896 01:40:57,890 --> 01:40:56,040 today that should be out in the spring 1897 01:41:00,470 --> 01:40:57,900 takes a while for them to translate it 1898 01:41:02,900 --> 01:41:00,480 but it but it but it's on its way anyway 1899 01:41:04,820 --> 01:41:02,910 and the Spanish Edition will be out 1900 01:41:08,210 --> 01:41:04,830 sometime this year I don't have a date 1901 01:41:11,240 --> 01:41:08,220 for it and then of course because of the 1902 01:41:15,260 --> 01:41:11,250 success of that we went on to look at 1903 01:41:18,410 --> 01:41:15,270 Irene his own experiences got inside the 1904 01:41:21,920 --> 01:41:18,420 lightning ball yeah and and a lot of 1905 01:41:24,230 --> 01:41:21,930 what her and her siblings had 1906 01:41:26,620 --> 01:41:24,240 encountered down the years so here we 1907 01:41:29,090 --> 01:41:26,630 have a bona fide scientist who's 1908 01:41:32,660 --> 01:41:29,100 experienced the phenomena you know 1909 01:41:35,960 --> 01:41:32,670 firsthand she's also a witness to the 1910 01:41:38,660 --> 01:41:35,970 Marfa lights in Texas and I think you 1911 01:41:39,980 --> 01:41:38,670 know one of the earlier communications I 1912 01:41:41,540 --> 01:41:39,990 had with I reckon if she sent me the 1913 01:41:44,570 --> 01:41:41,550 photograph she took of the Marfa lights 1914 01:41:47,030 --> 01:41:44,580 nothing spectacular but but they were 1915 01:41:48,800 --> 01:41:47,040 there to be seen but for those that are 1916 01:41:52,190 --> 01:41:48,810 not aware the Marfa lights Marfa in 1917 01:41:54,980 --> 01:41:52,200 Texas Texas is one of these areas around 1918 01:41:58,220 --> 01:41:54,990 the world that seems to have you know a 1919 01:42:00,980 --> 01:41:58,230 manifestation of light like walls like 1920 01:42:03,460 --> 01:42:00,990 phenomena chronic what will other places 1921 01:42:06,290 --> 01:42:03,470 for example our house down and in 1922 01:42:09,050 --> 01:42:06,300 central Norway the Pentagon Hills over 1923 01:42:10,670 --> 01:42:09,060 for the UK places in Australia in 1924 01:42:15,050 --> 01:42:10,680 Austrailia the calm the min min lights 1925 01:42:18,560 --> 01:42:15,060 for example yeah yeah sir there areas 1926 01:42:20,360 --> 01:42:18,570 but you know it's it's so that was one 1927 01:42:24,110 --> 01:42:20,370 of my earliest communications with Irina 1928 01:42:26,080 --> 01:42:24,120 and I thought well well you know we're 1929 01:42:29,030 --> 01:42:26,090 on a roll here while we have a bona fide 1930 01:42:32,060 --> 01:42:29,040 scientists talking about her work and 1931 01:42:34,130 --> 01:42:32,070 her experiences you know was there 1932 01:42:35,840 --> 01:42:34,140 something else that that was still in 1933 01:42:39,050 --> 01:42:35,850 her files and because she's been 1934 01:42:41,690 --> 01:42:39,060 involved for such a long john kreese 1935 01:42:44,600 --> 01:42:41,700 wealth you know in public you know in 1936 01:42:48,500 --> 01:42:44,610 UFO groups and behind the scenes for 1937 01:42:49,850 --> 01:42:48,510 example the title for her latest book 1938 01:42:53,150 --> 01:42:49,860 sacred corridors 1939 01:42:55,190 --> 01:42:53,160 comes from the introduction she's 1940 01:42:56,420 --> 01:42:55,200 literally talking about her involvement 1941 01:42:58,700 --> 01:42:56,430 working at the Battelle Memorial 1942 01:43:01,760 --> 01:42:58,710 Institute and wright-patterson Air Force 1943 01:43:04,070 --> 01:43:01,770 Base and she said I walked down the 1944 01:43:05,780 --> 01:43:04,080 sacred corridors where official UFO 1945 01:43:07,150 --> 01:43:05,790 research was conducted and says there's 1946 01:43:09,990 --> 01:43:07,160 you die 1947 01:43:13,480 --> 01:43:10,000 that's what sacred corridors refers to 1948 01:43:18,540 --> 01:43:13,490 and it is exactly right you know she did 1949 01:43:21,100 --> 01:43:18,550 this her husband he went to area 51 and 1950 01:43:24,880 --> 01:43:21,110 you know there's no you know he's got 1951 01:43:27,250 --> 01:43:24,890 his paperwork we published those in UFOs 1952 01:43:30,070 --> 01:43:27,260 today he was at Nellis Air Force place 1953 01:43:32,010 --> 01:43:30,080 which is part of area 51 yeah yeah you 1954 01:43:34,420 --> 01:43:32,020 know he's not claiming to have seen any 1955 01:43:37,390 --> 01:43:34,430 spaceships of reverse-engineered 1956 01:43:39,630 --> 01:43:37,400 anything he did work there so it just 1957 01:43:44,290 --> 01:43:39,640 goes to show the kind of circles that 1958 01:43:46,060 --> 01:43:44,300 Irina moves himself to speak nothing and 1959 01:43:47,860 --> 01:43:46,070 I think she even won some kind of award 1960 01:43:51,160 --> 01:43:47,870 for her first book as well 1961 01:43:53,350 --> 01:43:51,170 all right yeah I wasn't aware of it so 1962 01:43:56,230 --> 01:43:53,360 she's definitely a qualified person to 1963 01:43:58,090 --> 01:43:56,240 be a to be writing about the subject but 1964 01:44:01,690 --> 01:43:58,100 we need more ladies to get involved this 1965 01:44:05,470 --> 01:44:01,700 is what we want well we need more people 1966 01:44:07,840 --> 01:44:05,480 . chris i mean i agree hey not just like 1967 01:44:10,450 --> 01:44:07,850 dr. Scott I mean yes I mean the more 1968 01:44:12,100 --> 01:44:10,460 scientists that are that are involved in 1969 01:44:18,040 --> 01:44:12,110 an open mind 1970 01:44:19,810 --> 01:44:18,050 welcome but one of the things you know 1971 01:44:22,840 --> 01:44:19,820 I've discussed with a number of people 1972 01:44:26,440 --> 01:44:22,850 is what we need more than anything is 1973 01:44:33,730 --> 01:44:26,450 the next generation you know I'm I'm not 1974 01:44:35,350 --> 01:44:33,740 old I'm 60 this way I've got more years 1975 01:44:37,180 --> 01:44:35,360 behind me and then I've got in front of 1976 01:44:39,160 --> 01:44:37,190 me that's well except I'm exactly the 1977 01:44:42,040 --> 01:44:39,170 same my friend I think I'm about a year 1978 01:44:44,520 --> 01:44:42,050 behind you yes I remember when we first 1979 01:44:47,440 --> 01:44:44,530 joined beautiful order sitting in a 1980 01:44:51,220 --> 01:44:47,450 meeting in London but you know we were 1981 01:44:52,840 --> 01:44:51,230 looked as the the new generation and he 1982 01:44:56,830 --> 01:44:52,850 can evade or smile with like what's 1983 01:44:58,600 --> 01:44:56,840 funny but you know I look around now and 1984 01:45:01,600 --> 01:44:58,610 I know things have changed and I know 1985 01:45:06,250 --> 01:45:01,610 it's the age of the things like that but 1986 01:45:09,040 --> 01:45:06,260 you know people may know say I'm wrong 1987 01:45:12,400 --> 01:45:09,050 but you know where's the next generation 1988 01:45:16,660 --> 01:45:12,410 I don't know where it is so I think more 1989 01:45:19,780 --> 01:45:16,670 than just you know more women and more 1990 01:45:20,990 --> 01:45:19,790 scientists we need more people from who 1991 01:45:24,620 --> 01:45:21,000 are half our age 1992 01:45:26,420 --> 01:45:24,630 and under to the for so to speak yeah 1993 01:45:30,170 --> 01:45:26,430 I'm sure there are people out there that 1994 01:45:32,810 --> 01:45:30,180 you you know that do take it I was going 1995 01:45:34,970 --> 01:45:32,820 to say a Rabi Delray Beach Christ in the 1996 01:45:37,310 --> 01:45:34,980 subject but perhaps the avengers' come a 1997 01:45:39,290 --> 01:45:37,320 forward yet to met themselves known that 1998 01:45:41,840 --> 01:45:39,300 is you know that's how I view it I make 1999 01:45:44,960 --> 01:45:41,850 for example yeah me Paul Sinclair I do 2000 01:45:46,490 --> 01:45:44,970 know he's he's in his 50s now and but I 2001 01:45:48,680 --> 01:45:46,500 do know he's been interested in the 2002 01:45:50,300 --> 01:45:48,690 subject since the late Nancy's so he 2003 01:45:52,970 --> 01:45:50,310 must've been in his thirties when he 2004 01:45:54,920 --> 01:45:52,980 became interested I think it's one of 2005 01:45:57,110 --> 01:45:54,930 those subjects that demands a little bit 2006 01:45:59,090 --> 01:45:57,120 of maturity as well though Phil well 2007 01:46:01,100 --> 01:45:59,100 yeah I mean I'll give you an example 2008 01:46:04,220 --> 01:46:01,110 Chris when I first started there was 2009 01:46:06,770 --> 01:46:04,230 lots of regional UFO groups and that's 2010 01:46:08,090 --> 01:46:06,780 why I joined the Yorkshire UFO society 2011 01:46:10,160 --> 01:46:08,100 because they were just down the road in 2012 01:46:13,040 --> 01:46:10,170 Leeds but I had somebody contact me 2013 01:46:15,800 --> 01:46:13,050 recently don't live that far from here 2014 01:46:17,720 --> 01:46:15,810 and said can you recommend a UFO group 2015 01:46:21,410 --> 01:46:17,730 that I can join and I just said it can't 2016 01:46:23,690 --> 01:46:21,420 that there aren't any you know and and 2017 01:46:27,080 --> 01:46:23,700 and that was the end of that I did say 2018 01:46:30,140 --> 01:46:27,090 you know were the ways to meet people of 2019 01:46:32,020 --> 01:46:30,150 alike - to attend meetings and 2020 01:46:37,100 --> 01:46:32,030 conferences and there's some of those 2021 01:46:39,110 --> 01:46:37,110 some what but as for UFO groups that 2022 01:46:40,820 --> 01:46:39,120 just like they just don't exist like 2023 01:46:44,030 --> 01:46:40,830 that you said we know of a handful but 2024 01:46:47,420 --> 01:46:44,040 but there's none in our area all right 2025 01:46:50,600 --> 01:46:47,430 sir so you know that's another one that 2026 01:46:53,570 --> 01:46:50,610 got away so to speak yes yes I guess it 2027 01:46:55,310 --> 01:46:53,580 is now you make shouldn't seem to fear 2028 01:46:57,470 --> 01:46:55,320 hind what can you remember any any 2029 01:46:59,960 --> 01:46:57,480 particular cases actually worked on at 2030 01:47:02,270 --> 01:46:59,970 all Phil oh absolutely I mean you know 2031 01:47:03,980 --> 01:47:02,280 if anybody gets chance to read some of 2032 01:47:07,040 --> 01:47:03,990 Cynthia's work you come in grab it 2033 01:47:10,180 --> 01:47:07,050 because it's fascinated because she 2034 01:47:12,770 --> 01:47:10,190 lived in Zimbabwe she traveled across 2035 01:47:15,230 --> 01:47:12,780 Africa with with in Zimbabwe suit she 2036 01:47:17,150 --> 01:47:15,240 was I won't say well-off but she was 2037 01:47:19,630 --> 01:47:17,160 comfortably off so she could she was 2038 01:47:23,000 --> 01:47:19,640 retired she could afford to travel and 2039 01:47:25,190 --> 01:47:23,010 of course I can't remember the date that 2040 01:47:29,210 --> 01:47:25,200 it happened but these the landing her 2041 01:47:33,110 --> 01:47:29,220 aerial school where all the children saw 2042 01:47:33,959 --> 01:47:33,120 this UFO guys yeah yeah about about 200 2043 01:47:37,290 --> 01:47:33,969 children from 2044 01:47:39,000 --> 01:47:37,300 that's right what cause you know a lot 2045 01:47:42,600 --> 01:47:39,010 of credence is given to the fact that 2046 01:47:43,529 --> 01:47:42,610 dr. John Mack went there but before any 2047 01:47:46,109 --> 01:47:43,539 of them got there 2048 01:47:50,759 --> 01:47:46,119 Cynthia was on site because it was in 2049 01:47:53,540 --> 01:47:50,769 Zimbabwe and you know the the BBC 2050 01:47:56,310 --> 01:47:53,550 African or whoever was there as well so 2051 01:47:59,969 --> 01:47:56,320 Cynthia was one of those you know on the 2052 01:48:01,620 --> 01:47:59,979 spot at the time and German researcher 2053 01:48:04,500 --> 01:48:01,630 Michael hesseman 2054 01:48:06,299 --> 01:48:04,510 he flew out from Germany and he stayed 2055 01:48:10,319 --> 01:48:06,309 with Cynthia and he went and interviewed 2056 01:48:12,390 --> 01:48:10,329 them as well so you know and I believe 2057 01:48:15,419 --> 01:48:12,400 there's a a documentary in the making 2058 01:48:20,250 --> 01:48:15,429 now about the aerial school incident and 2059 01:48:22,919 --> 01:48:20,260 it is fascinating but I mean Cynthia 2060 01:48:25,830 --> 01:48:22,929 like I said was a large lady the big 2061 01:48:28,410 --> 01:48:25,840 sense of humor but this is a two story 2062 01:48:33,209 --> 01:48:28,420 she went to interview somewhere in South 2063 01:48:35,219 --> 01:48:33,219 Africa the the chief of a local what we 2064 01:48:37,020 --> 01:48:35,229 probably call a tribe I think that 2065 01:48:42,180 --> 01:48:37,030 probably an insult but he was the chief 2066 01:48:45,560 --> 01:48:42,190 and it see this silver suit identity and 2067 01:48:48,890 --> 01:48:45,570 what have yourself Cynthia said to him 2068 01:48:54,259 --> 01:48:48,900 chief you know what do you think he was 2069 01:48:58,169 --> 01:48:54,269 SAS was the spirits of our ancestors 2070 01:49:01,830 --> 01:48:58,179 your ancestors used to wear you know 2071 01:49:06,109 --> 01:49:01,840 animal skins and I need you said well 2072 01:49:12,620 --> 01:49:09,120 excellent Cynthia told this in much 2073 01:49:15,299 --> 01:49:12,630 greater detail and I could remember 2074 01:49:18,120 --> 01:49:15,309 conference I organized in in in 2075 01:49:21,680 --> 01:49:18,130 Sheffield and she was on the stage but 2076 01:49:24,989 --> 01:49:21,690 that's just one of whatever an array of 2077 01:49:27,600 --> 01:49:24,999 bizarre encounters there was another one 2078 01:49:28,919 --> 01:49:27,610 again it's in Africa someone I can't 2079 01:49:31,890 --> 01:49:28,929 remember where it was or what the date 2080 01:49:35,520 --> 01:49:31,900 was but the super cars going down the 2081 01:49:39,029 --> 01:49:35,530 highway and literally in the in their 2082 01:49:41,279 --> 01:49:39,039 valley next to them he's a rocket you 2083 01:49:44,910 --> 01:49:41,289 know a spaceship rocket like out of 2084 01:49:47,639 --> 01:49:44,920 fireball xl5 but she says the witnesses 2085 01:49:49,979 --> 01:49:47,649 said he had USA on the side of it 2086 01:49:52,319 --> 01:49:49,989 I'm sure I'm Phil I'm sorry to interrupt 2087 01:49:55,279 --> 01:49:52,329 you there but you better explain fire 2088 01:49:58,560 --> 01:49:55,289 politics Hellfire ball except the flag 2089 01:50:01,589 --> 01:49:58,570 is Jerry Anderson way back in a long 2090 01:50:05,040 --> 01:50:01,599 time ago you know they had they had 2091 01:50:08,459 --> 01:50:05,050 Rockets you know the sort of down there 2092 01:50:09,179 --> 01:50:08,469 and and and you know Flash Gordon type 2093 01:50:13,350 --> 01:50:09,189 rockets 2094 01:50:17,939 --> 01:50:13,360 yeah like thank you for explaining my 2095 01:50:19,770 --> 01:50:17,949 air my mum tell me about that why she 2096 01:50:22,560 --> 01:50:19,780 said you know there were several people 2097 01:50:25,439 --> 01:50:22,570 on this this highway it wasn't just one 2098 01:50:26,819 --> 01:50:25,449 person and this rocket was such wasn't 2099 01:50:29,909 --> 01:50:26,829 going that fast because it was sort of 2100 01:50:31,979 --> 01:50:29,919 parallel with the traffic and it had you 2101 01:50:35,609 --> 01:50:31,989 I say written on the side of it and she 2102 01:50:39,330 --> 01:50:35,619 says what you may give most bizarre 2103 01:50:41,790 --> 01:50:39,340 thing and and you know after she used to 2104 01:50:44,759 --> 01:50:41,800 do a little a little homemade magazine 2105 01:50:47,489 --> 01:50:44,769 which air I have and she did oh she 2106 01:50:49,199 --> 01:50:47,499 wrote a couple of books which I have and 2107 01:50:52,649 --> 01:50:49,209 they're like gold dust you know they 2108 01:50:54,179 --> 01:50:52,659 really are and you know Cynthia would 2109 01:50:58,919 --> 01:50:54,189 just put I remembered I did a lecture 2110 01:51:02,939 --> 01:50:58,929 once in Southport believe it or not and 2111 01:51:04,919 --> 01:51:02,949 I've just just start my presentation can 2112 01:51:08,129 --> 01:51:04,929 a little pops up in the audience but 2113 01:51:11,369 --> 01:51:08,139 Cynthia she was there and then again she 2114 01:51:14,459 --> 01:51:11,379 was she was visiting her family um but 2115 01:51:15,839 --> 01:51:14,469 one of you know many women that have 2116 01:51:17,549 --> 01:51:15,849 been involved it's just like it's a 2117 01:51:20,939 --> 01:51:17,559 curious like in in most walks of life 2118 01:51:25,109 --> 01:51:20,949 that's not enough I definitely assert 2119 01:51:26,969 --> 01:51:25,119 that absolutely 2120 01:51:29,339 --> 01:51:26,979 so listen Phil what you got planned for 2121 01:51:33,509 --> 01:51:29,349 the next day a few weeks before we speak 2122 01:51:35,459 --> 01:51:33,519 again well we go back to dr. Irena Scott 2123 01:51:39,239 --> 01:51:35,469 I mean the first thing dr. Scott and I 2124 01:51:44,069 --> 01:51:39,249 worked on there was an item we released 2125 01:51:47,909 --> 01:51:44,079 at your conference in Hall yeah and that 2126 01:51:50,939 --> 01:51:47,919 was deputy sheriff Charles H Fergus 2127 01:51:53,069 --> 01:51:50,949 oh yes yes no the witness there the 2128 01:51:54,719 --> 01:51:53,079 witnesses the Rendel to Rendlesham 2129 01:51:56,729 --> 01:51:54,729 incident the air loss willie that's 2130 01:51:59,189 --> 01:51:56,739 right the laws are aware a few years 2131 01:52:01,470 --> 01:51:59,199 back I was contacted by a film company 2132 01:52:03,479 --> 01:52:01,480 and they wanted to make a film about Rob 2133 01:52:06,780 --> 01:52:03,489 well and they said we've got we've got a 2134 01:52:11,550 --> 01:52:06,790 video interview of an old boy he's now 2135 01:52:14,610 --> 01:52:11,560 dead and it's the the the VHS that they 2136 01:52:17,910 --> 01:52:14,620 had cassette was filmed in the late 90s 2137 01:52:20,250 --> 01:52:17,920 so they send me it and you see this old 2138 01:52:21,570 --> 01:52:20,260 guy being interviewed not a formal 2139 01:52:27,720 --> 01:52:21,580 interview or the fall on him around his 2140 01:52:31,140 --> 01:52:27,730 house and he was deputy Fergus that's 2141 01:52:33,140 --> 01:52:31,150 the place called Big Spring sis and he 2142 01:52:36,360 --> 01:52:33,150 claimed that him in the sheriff in in 2143 01:52:40,170 --> 01:52:36,370 1947 have been looking for a guy or 2144 01:52:42,780 --> 01:52:40,180 being there caching good checks and he'd 2145 01:52:45,030 --> 01:52:42,790 been found and put in jail in Roswell so 2146 01:52:47,370 --> 01:52:45,040 they arranged to go pick him up and on 2147 01:52:48,750 --> 01:52:47,380 the way there they heard about the crash 2148 01:52:53,130 --> 01:52:48,760 on the police radio 2149 01:52:55,140 --> 01:52:53,140 they found it they watched it they saw 2150 01:52:57,900 --> 01:52:55,150 the UFO the dead creatures they were 2151 01:53:01,800 --> 01:52:57,910 politely but firmly asked to leave the 2152 01:53:04,680 --> 01:53:01,810 area and he'd never told a soul so dr. 2153 01:53:09,080 --> 01:53:04,690 Scott worked on this with me and we 2154 01:53:11,700 --> 01:53:09,090 managed to find Charles fergus's son I 2155 01:53:13,920 --> 01:53:11,710 mean said yes Phillip he said you know 2156 01:53:18,210 --> 01:53:13,930 what my father told me about this back 2157 01:53:19,860 --> 01:53:18,220 in the 1950s and he knew roughly that it 2158 01:53:22,950 --> 01:53:19,870 was the 50s because they'd moved house 2159 01:53:25,229 --> 01:53:22,960 at that time and of course in the 1950s 2160 01:53:26,970 --> 01:53:25,239 Roswell was not on anyways funny bodies 2161 01:53:30,150 --> 01:53:26,980 map it wasn't written it there was no 2162 01:53:32,280 --> 01:53:30,160 way well we had a newspaper article a - 2163 01:53:34,350 --> 01:53:32,290 didn't we back in the 1947 and that was 2164 01:53:36,150 --> 01:53:34,360 about well that's it was a 15 minute you 2165 01:53:41,040 --> 01:53:36,160 know Almanac sensation and then it 2166 01:53:43,320 --> 01:53:41,050 disappeared and so what dr. Scott and 2167 01:53:45,090 --> 01:53:43,330 I've been working on now now we're going 2168 01:53:48,510 --> 01:53:45,100 to be releasing a lot more of this in 2169 01:53:50,940 --> 01:53:48,520 outer limits magazine and at the outer 2170 01:53:54,360 --> 01:53:50,950 limits magazine conference this August 2171 01:53:57,000 --> 01:53:54,370 in Pontiac with Calvin Parker means the 2172 01:54:00,060 --> 01:53:57,010 fact we've tracked down some other 2173 01:54:03,570 --> 01:54:00,070 witnesses to the Pascagoula case which 2174 01:54:07,410 --> 01:54:03,580 was October the 11th 1973 Pascagoula 2175 01:54:10,260 --> 01:54:07,420 River Mississippi Calvin Parker and the 2176 01:54:12,690 --> 01:54:10,270 late Charles Hickson and literally this 2177 01:54:14,009 --> 01:54:12,700 this married couple were on the opposite 2178 01:54:17,040 --> 01:54:14,019 bank of the river 2179 01:54:20,479 --> 01:54:17,050 at the same time as Calvin and Charlie's 2180 01:54:24,060 --> 01:54:20,489 encounter so they were on the east side 2181 01:54:26,129 --> 01:54:24,070 they were on the west side and it's a 2182 01:54:29,189 --> 01:54:26,139 wide river so the wording you know they 2183 01:54:30,720 --> 01:54:29,199 can't see each other but they were 2184 01:54:33,720 --> 01:54:30,730 waiting for the boat coming in they 2185 01:54:37,229 --> 01:54:33,730 worked for a fish wholesalers or a 2186 01:54:40,709 --> 01:54:37,239 restaurant or something like that and it 2187 01:54:42,239 --> 01:54:40,719 was five hours late so the gentleman and 2188 01:54:44,100 --> 01:54:42,249 how to sleep in the back but his wife 2189 01:54:46,640 --> 01:54:44,110 was in the front seat and she could see 2190 01:54:52,259 --> 01:54:46,650 the lights come these blue lights and 2191 01:54:54,629 --> 01:54:52,269 she got she got her husband up and they 2192 01:54:57,359 --> 01:54:54,639 saw them together they got out of the 2193 01:55:00,419 --> 01:54:57,369 car he sort of walked off in front and 2194 01:55:02,279 --> 01:55:00,429 the watch these lights over we're coming 2195 01:55:03,750 --> 01:55:02,289 in and Charlie were because they knew it 2196 01:55:06,470 --> 01:55:03,760 was there because of the shipyard that 2197 01:55:09,600 --> 01:55:06,480 was there and they seemed to be either 2198 01:55:11,189 --> 01:55:09,610 hovering looking for something or she 2199 01:55:14,459 --> 01:55:11,199 said it looked like they were lost 2200 01:55:18,439 --> 01:55:14,469 almost and there was this for about 20 2201 01:55:24,060 --> 01:55:18,449 minutes grace but the peculiar thing and 2202 01:55:26,600 --> 01:55:24,070 and this it's that lady witness said 2203 01:55:29,339 --> 01:55:26,610 there was a man came up out of the water 2204 01:55:31,259 --> 01:55:29,349 all right this is nice right yeah 2205 01:55:33,000 --> 01:55:31,269 this actual people I have to get they 2206 01:55:34,830 --> 01:55:33,010 get themselves together and get them 2207 01:55:36,600 --> 01:55:34,840 tickets part and get that's nice to get 2208 01:55:38,549 --> 01:55:36,610 more information that's right and she 2209 01:55:42,569 --> 01:55:38,559 said you then went back into the water 2210 01:55:44,970 --> 01:55:42,579 and you come out again nice fascinating 2211 01:55:46,919 --> 01:55:44,980 so absolutely so so I know we're running 2212 01:55:49,470 --> 01:55:46,929 outta time at dr. Irena Scott has 2213 01:55:54,540 --> 01:55:49,480 interviewed these these this this Marie 2214 01:55:56,489 --> 01:55:54,550 couple twice and just today Calvin 2215 01:56:00,029 --> 01:55:56,499 Parker has spoken to them on the 2216 01:56:00,859 --> 01:56:00,039 telephone and they are arranging to me 2217 01:56:03,509 --> 01:56:00,869 an avalanche 2218 01:56:07,430 --> 01:56:03,519 according to Calvin the lady was crying 2219 01:56:10,770 --> 01:56:07,440 because she'd never met Calvin before 2220 01:56:12,359 --> 01:56:10,780 yeah never you know knew how to contact 2221 01:56:13,770 --> 01:56:12,369 him and she said well at least now I 2222 01:56:15,989 --> 01:56:13,780 know I've spoke to you I'm not crazy 2223 01:56:18,750 --> 01:56:15,999 because things like Swiss are we're 2224 01:56:21,930 --> 01:56:18,760 right above where you were so what on 2225 01:56:25,680 --> 01:56:21,940 the trail of that some documentation 2226 01:56:27,870 --> 01:56:25,690 that potentially these is dynamite that 2227 01:56:30,750 --> 01:56:27,880 will release at the conference 2228 01:56:33,149 --> 01:56:30,760 if not before but certainly it would be 2229 01:56:34,530 --> 01:56:33,159 discussed at the conference we may be 2230 01:56:38,149 --> 01:56:34,540 able to get it out in the magazine 2231 01:56:42,810 --> 01:56:38,159 before then yeah that you don't change 2232 01:56:45,959 --> 01:56:42,820 new information on what is you know one 2233 01:56:48,569 --> 01:56:45,969 of the the world's most fascinating 2234 01:56:51,780 --> 01:56:48,579 close encounter cases that's in my 2235 01:56:53,550 --> 01:56:51,790 opinion absolutely so that I do agree we 2236 01:56:55,350 --> 01:56:53,560 feel yeah it is 2237 01:56:58,740 --> 01:56:55,360 you know it's be honestly is one of the 2238 01:57:00,000 --> 01:56:58,750 last of the classic encounter UFO 2239 01:57:01,680 --> 01:57:00,010 encounters into your abduction 2240 01:57:04,109 --> 01:57:01,690 encounters whatever you want to call it 2241 01:57:06,270 --> 01:57:04,119 that is there is only recent ring you 2242 01:57:08,490 --> 01:57:06,280 know it's only recently been told in 2243 01:57:09,930 --> 01:57:08,500 Calvin's own words and now we're getting 2244 01:57:11,370 --> 01:57:09,940 more and more information coming up 2245 01:57:12,990 --> 01:57:11,380 which can only be a good thing that's it 2246 01:57:17,430 --> 01:57:13,000 I mean Calvin literally did a book 2247 01:57:20,640 --> 01:57:17,440 signing in Pascagoula recently and a 2248 01:57:22,979 --> 01:57:20,650 number of people have come forward since 2249 01:57:27,149 --> 01:57:22,989 then whether you'll go on the record is 2250 01:57:32,939 --> 01:57:27,159 another matter but we're hopeful and you 2251 01:57:35,129 --> 01:57:32,949 know Calvin and I are still amazed the 2252 01:57:38,280 --> 01:57:35,139 you know every week something new 2253 01:57:40,649 --> 01:57:38,290 happens and there's other things 2254 01:57:43,589 --> 01:57:40,659 happening in the town of pascagoula that 2255 01:57:48,270 --> 01:57:43,599 will will will will make your readers 2256 01:57:49,830 --> 01:57:48,280 aware of injeel gospel not the moment 2257 01:57:52,709 --> 01:57:49,840 but this is something that the town 2258 01:57:55,919 --> 01:57:52,719 they're doing and then of course we're 2259 01:57:57,990 --> 01:57:55,929 still in full discussion with a producer 2260 01:58:00,839 --> 01:57:58,000 about a movie it's not it's not a 2261 01:58:04,080 --> 01:58:00,849 definite there's no you know it's just a 2262 01:58:08,459 --> 01:58:04,090 possibility at the moment but things are 2263 01:58:10,439 --> 01:58:08,469 inching forward so come August we may 2264 01:58:12,240 --> 01:58:10,449 have something else who knows if not 2265 01:58:14,399 --> 01:58:12,250 before them solutely brilliant that's 2266 01:58:16,290 --> 01:58:14,409 well as we've got about 60 seconds left 2267 01:58:18,600 --> 01:58:16,300 Phil I'm just going to you know take 2268 01:58:20,069 --> 01:58:18,610 this time once again on my behalf and 2269 01:58:23,189 --> 01:58:20,079 I'm sure you'd like to agree with me 2270 01:58:25,260 --> 01:58:23,199 that we'd like to thank dr. arena Scott 2271 01:58:27,479 --> 01:58:25,270 for a town this evening to talk to us 2272 01:58:28,890 --> 01:58:27,489 we'd also like to thank all the 2273 01:58:30,490 --> 01:58:28,900 listeners as well thank you very much 2274 01:58:33,190 --> 01:58:30,500 Pete sound this evening 2275 01:58:34,630 --> 01:58:33,200 and once again Philip just got to see it 2276 01:58:35,230 --> 01:58:34,640 it's been an absolute pleasure talking 2277 01:58:36,820 --> 01:58:35,240 to you 2278 01:58:40,630 --> 01:58:36,830 yeah no it doesn't work if they threw 2279 01:58:43,270 --> 01:58:40,640 across it I mean if we've got to admit 2280 01:58:50,590 --> 01:58:43,280 you've been with us Laurel T certainly 2281 01:58:58,070 --> 01:58:50,600 you think that you know good night